I agree with you 100%.

 

There is no rev limiter (below red line) at any time, including during the break-in period. You can use and abuse it in any way you wish.

I've kept closely to the break-in restrictions except for a brief moment today when a C5 Corvette wanted to play. It took a quick press of the M button and a few more seconds for the point to be made. When I blasted past, I immediately slowed down to resume my break-in. He pulled along side with a stunned look on his face and waved. He was clearly awed, but a very good sport.
Tom

 

According to what I was told/my believes you shouldn't force the engine at once. Like you said the first thing that is crucial is engine temprature. That the fluids get upto temprature and into the engine before doing anything. Several brand dealers (MB and BMW) have told me it's best to let the car running in idle for a few minutes (specialy in the winter) while breaking it in so the engine can get upto temprature.

Second it's best to open the car up slowly. Don't punch the pedal at once or do sudden downshifts/kick downs. If suddenly too much pressure is applied to the rough piston rings then there's a possibilty they can scratch the cylinder walls which you do not want. Slowly and gently get the engine upto revs and use the complete rpm range. But don't over strain the engine by demanding too much power or speed.

At first be gentle no high revving and then slowly on a daily basis go higher and higher and on occasion open it up.

This has worked well with my 3 other cars and this is how I will break my M6 in.

This is the order of new cars.
VW Passat Variant TDI (company lease) -> BMW 525TDS -> MB E500 (current) -> BMW M6.

Offtopic: After driven 2 turbo diesel cars I've completely sworn of them. The 525TDS was nice still had the same problem as other diesel cars. And that problem is power. Don't get me wrong, these engines have huge amounts of power, knock you into the back of your seat kind of power. The problem however is that the power range is very small, ussualy from 2000 to 4000 rpm. The power suddenly comes up causing huge acceleration and then as quickly as it came up it drops away. It needs alot of getting used to and if you want to drive fast you need to memorize alot of the shift points using the revcounter, you can't really get the feel like in a gasoline car.

No sir from now on it's either gasoline or LPG for me.

 

I agree to a point. I certainly wouldn't beat on my car either. But five minutes off the lot and I inadvertently blew past 5500 and up to 6000rpm. The inertia of higher RPM's does cause connecting rod and ring stretching that in the long run probably extends the life of the internals. Running the car at the same RPM all day long is probably the worst thing to do since you run the risk of scoring the cylinder walls at a certain level and not allowing the parts to seat properly. We're talking about microns here and the engine tolerances are so refined that pushing the motor to 8000prm briefly is problably not an issue.

 

Went for a drive at the dealer on the new M5 and the limiter was not removed. It was limited to 5500 RPM. Very annoying. The dealer wasn't very informed about the car and didn't know to turn off the feature for the customers to drive the car properly. Needless to say the car felt sluggish and lifeless. Very different from e39 M5. Closer to M3 actually. There is nothing up to 4K RPM - after that the car gets a kick, but the limiter kills it at 5500.

I've had M3 for 3 years now and it spends 30-40 days at the track - the only way to drive it is to rev it. Keep it 6-8K RPM and the car is lightning, below 5K M3 has nothing. e60 M5 was very similar.

Ok now to the topic of the thread. e60 M5 comes with the limiter (good thing for the transporting personnel who have no need to rev the cold engines to 8K to put it on the ramp). But the dealer has the option to remove the limiter right away and not wait till 1200 miles. (similar to e46 M3)

I broke in many engines in my life and the best way to do it is to apply compression and power to the rings while they are being sealed. You have to use full RPM range.

The only way to be cautions about is to warm up the oil. Whnt the oil is 210 and higher - go to town. Not saying beat on the engine and hang it in 1st at 8K, but give it progressive full throttle acceleration through all gears, use engine braking, very engine speeds. The worst thing you can do to the new engine is to lag it. And that's seems to be the believe because of the way the manuals are written.
Went to 2 schools at BMW South Carolina. They use brand new cars and they don't wait for 1200 miles to drive them. Just last Wednesday and Thursday BMW NA brought new e60 M5s to Lime Rock - they were not limited. Several BMW mechanics confirmed that it is done to cover the *** for parts malfunction (like oil pump failure, SMG hick ups) and mainly to make the driver learn the car. Engines are running at the factory before they are put in the cars and the tolerances are so tight now, there is nothing to be afraid of.

Ask your dealer to remove the limiter and turn all the features on - don't torture yourself and the car.

Here is the link to a similar opinion on web site;
http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

Oh, please, not this again! The link is to a guy whose experience centers on motorcycle engines. The question -- to which the answer should be obvious -- is should a new M5 owner who has invested more than $90,000 in the car follow the break-in procedures specified by the manufacturer that has developed and tested the engine for years or ignore those procedures because some self-appointed motorcycle guru says so?

In addition, after a ride and drive today in an M5 today, I do not agree with the claim that below 5,000 rpms the engine "has nothing." I suppose everyone's idea of forceful acceleration is different, but I am quite certain I felt "something" fairly impressive well before the tachomoter touched 5,000.

Finally, as Tom correctly says, there is no rev limiter at 5,000 rpm or anywhere else below redline.

 

One of the very best ways that I actually read here to ensure great piston ring seal is the following: Get the car in to a high gear such as 6th or 7th at low speed, being careful NOT to lug the engine. Then press the throttle to the floor, making sure of course that you are in M mode, not D. Release the throttle when the revs are getting close to 5-6K or whatever the maximum running in recommendation is. This creates a very high vacuum which will help draw oil up around the rings helping to ensure a good seal/wear pattern. I've done it on every car I've owned since reading it here.
Bish

 

Went for a drive at the dealer on the new M5 and the limiter was not removed. It was limited to 5500 RPM. Very annoying...

Can you describe what happened with you got to 5500? There is no limiter, so I'm curious what you felt. Did the engine cut out, was it fuel starved, spark starved, sudden loss of power, progressive loss of power?

 

Oh, please, not this again! The link is to a guy whose experience centers on motorcycle engines. The question -- to which the answer should be obvious -- is should a new M5 owner who has invested more than $90,000 in the car follow the break-in procedures specified by the manufacturer that has developed and tested the engine for years or ignore those procedures because some self-appointed motorcycle guru says so?

In addition, after a ride and drive today in an M5 today, I do not agree with the claim that below 5,000 rpms the engine "has nothing." I suppose everyone's idea of forceful acceleration is different, but I am quite certain I felt "something" fairly impressive well before the tachomoter touched 5,000.

Finally, as Tom correctly says, there is no rev limiter at 5,000 rpm or anywhere else below redline.

The comments on this topic always amaze me. I agree with MRichmond. There are good reasons that the factory has specified such a specific regimen for our M5's. My guess is that they have to do with longevity, dependability and ultimately for them, lower warranty service costs. Unless I'm missing something, I think I would have those same goals.

 

Oh, please, not this again! The link is to a guy whose experience centers on motorcycle engines. The question -- to which the answer should be obvious -- is should a new M5 owner who has invested more than $90,000 in the car follow the break-in procedures specified by the manufacturer that has developed and tested the engine for years or ignore those procedures because some self-appointed motorcycle guru says so?

I have to agree with that. The break in procedures of supersports bikes (like my ZX12R) are very thightly defined and don't match anything that guy said. Kawasaki even had engine blocks blowing up because of wrong break in. After which they started specifying a break in of 5000km, max 6000rpm and listing exactly what todo and not todo. For a bike that can do 200+ km/h in 3th gear and doesn't have any power in the low range, break in is very annoying.

There were some serious accidents on the German autobahn because of blocks blowing up at 300+ km/h speeds. People breaking their bike in upto 2000km, then finally open it up and BOOM! gone.

 

Went for a drive at the dealer on the new M5 and the limiter was not removed. It was limited to 5500 RPM. Very annoying. The dealer wasn't very informed about the car and didn't know to turn off the feature for the customers to drive the car properly. Needless to say the car felt sluggish and lifeless. Very different from e39 M5. Closer to M3 actually. There is nothing up to 4K RPM - after that the car gets a kick, but the limiter kills it at 5500.

I've had M3 for 3 years now and it spends 30-40 days at the track - the only way to drive it is to rev it. Keep it 6-8K RPM and the car is lightning, below 5K M3 has nothing. e60 M5 was very similar.

Ok now to the topic of the thread. e60 M5 comes with the limiter (good thing for the transporting personnel who have no need to rev the cold engines to 8K to put it on the ramp). But the dealer has the option to remove the limiter right away and not wait till 1200 miles. (similar to e46 M3)

I broke in many engines in my life and the best way to do it is to apply compression and power to the rings while they are being sealed. You have to use full RPM range.

The only way to be cautions about is to warm up the oil. Whnt the oil is 210 and higher - go to town. Not saying beat on the engine and hang it in 1st at 8K, but give it progressive full throttle acceleration through all gears, use engine braking, very engine speeds. The worst thing you can do to the new engine is to lag it. And that's seems to be the believe because of the way the manuals are written.
Went to 2 schools at BMW South Carolina. They use brand new cars and they don't wait for 1200 miles to drive them. Just last Wednesday and Thursday BMW NA brought new e60 M5s to Lime Rock - they were not limited. Several BMW mechanics confirmed that it is done to cover the *** for parts malfunction (like oil pump failure, SMG hick ups) and mainly to make the driver learn the car. Engines are running at the factory before they are put in the cars and the tolerances are so tight now, there is nothing to be afraid of.

Ask your dealer to remove the limiter and turn all the features on - don't torture yourself and the car.

Here is the link to a similar opinion on web site;
http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm

Here we go again. :confused3 That site has been posted so many times it's crazy. The guy is talking about motorcycle engines.

I've heard this debate on the Porsche boards for years. They say the engine is broken in at the factory, so no need to follow Porsche's break in procedures. Well, I've been to the Porsche factory, and yes--they do run the engines on a bench before they install them in the car--but this is not what the break in procedure is about. You need to allow the entire drive train to break in--including the engine, and running it on a bench for a few minutes doesn't accomplish that.

And then there's always the expert tech at the dealer, who whispers in your ear...like he's in possession of the holy grail...saying--don't worry about your $100K car--drive it like you stole it. Give me a break.

 

There is NO limiter to keep the engine below 5500RPM before the 1200 mile service. It sounds like you had the car in P400 and not P500.

MJ
'06

 

A significant part of the break-in period is dedicated toward the bevel gears in the differential and also the transmission gears. Seating rings is 20% of a break-in period...think differential, transmission and bearings. The last thing you want on a newly mating differential gear set is heavy loading (high power transfer), especially if you attach that to high rpm (speed) of the gear set. Trust the BMW engineers.

 

I agree with MRichmond as well. I use to drive an E55 and this guy's posts was also on the MB forum. All this talk about moto engines. I'm sure the guys at BMW made all this effort to put it in the manuals and have running-in instruction stickers stuck to the windscreen for good reason. I must confess though I think the running-in period specified by BMW is a bit long. I'm not saying they are not correct, but for someone that lives in H.K it is pretty difficult to follow. I mean for me to reach the end of the specified 5000km run-in period will take me a good 5 months!! Hong Kong is a very small place!!:grrrr: I try......I try.....

 

having broken-in (and broken down) many engines in my life, i agree 100% with you.

however...

in essence you wrote that you know more about engine break-in than the folks that designed, built and raced the car...

just playing devil's advocate... as usual

alex
few cars

 

I had two E39 M5s. The first I drove hard from the beginning and I abided by the break-in restrictions for the second. The second one ultimately felt much better and had better power. It also used less oil. I don't know if this was caused by the different break-in procedure or they just started out different.

Tom

 

This is why they change the rear diff oil at 1,200 miles on the E39.

A significant part of the break-in period is dedicated toward the bevel gears in the differential and also the transmission gears. Seating rings is 20% of a break-in period...think differential, transmission and bearings. The last thing you want on a newly mating differential gear set is heavy loading (high power transfer), especially if you attach that to high rpm (speed) of the gear set. Trust the BMW engineers.

 

I have an uncle who shares this same belief that to properly break in a car you should drive it hard right off the lot and don't look back. It worked well for him since he only drove the cars for 1 year then got rid of them, until he bought a Porsche GT2. He broke it in like every other car he has owned; until 800 miles when he spun a main bearing. Of coarse he blamed it on a faulty engine block not his methods.

There is a reason the engineers have setup the break in period. They don't sit down one day and say, "ah, I think the breakin should be 1,200 miles".

 

I'm getting my first break-in service (1500 km) tomorrow!!

 

I'm getting my first break-in service (1500 km) tomorrow!!

Isn't it 2000km?

Best regards,

 

I thought it is 2000km as well, but I've driven about 1400km and the onboard computer keeps telling me that I have to go in for service within the next 70km......

 

I have an uncle who shares this same belief that to properly break in a car you should drive it hard right off the lot and don't look back. It worked well for him since he only drove the cars for 1 year then got rid of them, until he bought a Porsche GT2. He broke it in like every other car he has owned; until 800 miles when he spun a main bearing. Of coarse he blamed it on a faulty engine block not his methods.

There is a reason the engineers have setup the break in period. They don't sit down one day and say, "ah, I think the breakin should be 1,200 miles".

Well, I hate to say it but Porsche breaks in their motors before they give you the car. This is done at the factory and is ready to race the day you drive it off the lot. Don't use Porsche as an example for break-in history and no problems downt the road with the car.

m5floyd

 

Well, I hate to say it but Porsche breaks in their motors before they give you the car. This is done at the factory and is ready to race the day you drive it off the lot. Don't use Porsche as an example for break-in history and no problems downt the road with the car.

m5floyd

Not so--see my post above.

I've been to the Porsche factory, and while it is true that they run each engine--after being lovingly hand built--on a bench before it's installed in the car, it is far from breaking in the engine. And breaking in is about the entire drive train, not just the engine--and a few minutes running on a bench does not break in the engine. Porsche still has a 2,000 mile recommended break in procedure for all their cars--except the Carrera GT, which is 1,000 miles.

 

If that is the case, then why does my Carrera S owners guide have a break in period in it? Is this the same as the M5, are we to just ignore it.

Well, I hate to say it but Porsche breaks in their motors before they give you the car. This is done at the factory and is ready to race the day you drive it off the lot. Don't use Porsche as an example for break-in history and no problems downt the road with the car.

m5floyd

 

Not so--see my post above.

I've been to the Porsche factory, and while it is true that they run each engine--after being lovingly hand built--on a bench before it's installed in the car, it is far from breaking in the engine. And breaking in is about the entire drive train, not just the engine--and a few minutes running on a bench does not break in the engine. Porsche still has a 2,000 mile recommended break in procedure for all their cars--except the Carrera GT, which is 1,000 miles.

ahhh....i would belive that, it's just so many people talk about it that they don't need to be run in. I am a believer of break in.

 

Not so--see my post above.

I've been to the Porsche factory, and while it is true that they run each engine--after being lovingly hand built--on a bench before it's installed in the car, it is far from breaking in the engine. And breaking in is about the entire drive train, not just the engine--and a few minutes running on a bench does not break in the engine. Porsche still has a 2,000 mile recommended break in procedure for all their cars--except the Carrera GT, which is 1,000 miles.

ahhh....i would belive that, it's just so many people talk about it that they don't need to be run in. I am a believer of break in.