SMG Hydraulics Failure analysis - BMW M5 Forum and M6 Forums
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post #1 of 18 Old 13th April 2019, 07:01 PM Thread Starter
Ferris
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SMG Hydraulics Failure analysis

I wasn't going to post yet another boring SMG rebuild thread but since everyone is posting today about SMG problems and we're all geeks that like to analyze things I figured why not.

So Two years ago i replaced my SMG motor and everything was fine till last october I'd get an yellow light on harder driving. Eventually it happened more frequently , for the record I have 91k on my 2010 M5. I'd hear the pump always running blah blah blah. I hooked up INPA and went for a ride and noticed btw shifts pressure wouldn't build then would then wouldn't. I figured it was a seal leak somewhere.

I pulled the tranny and was annoyed at FTE and BMW for the shittacular wires on the sensor strip and decide I'm going to go balls out with a rebuild and it's either gonna work or with boat season coming up I have new anchor and will just bite the bullet and buy the whole unit from BMW. insert typical rebuild story here.

I did decide to replace the internal hydraulic pump seals (Burkhart) , go with the MLR Engineering motor the old one has been working really hard lately, new accumulator because it was towards the end of the range, iirc 29 bar and 28 is the lowest of the range, new seals for all the solenoid( MLR Engineering) and I also went with the Burkhart engineering unicorn piss fluid.

Since I haven't seen a pump rebuild thread I'll say don't be too scared of it, it's just like any hydraulic gear pump or motor. It's all of 10 parts orientation matters but it's not a big deal to figure out if you mess up as it's like any other pump.

What I found though was the internal pumps seals had a crack in it and a few of the shift orings had squared themselves off and were hardened. I assume these were my issues.

The pump runs very little now, the system holds pressures very well, it used to drop like a rock while cruising/sitting but now it barely trickles down and then between shifts when it needs to rebuild it shoots up rather quick.

The attached pic the circled area is where one of the cracks are, and one of the oring what was squared, it's hard to see in the pics Oh well

You have to write MLR for the orings, I actually measured the old ones but decided to go with them since they had them all ready properly sized.

Also big shout out to Rob an MLR, he was very communicative.

https://mlreng.com/collections/bmw-m...hout-connector


https://burkhart-engineering.com/epa...Products/54443


https://burkhart-engineering.com/epa...Products/54134
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2001 E36/7 MRoadster
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Last edited by Ferris; 13th April 2019 at 07:02 PM.
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post #2 of 18 Old 13th April 2019, 07:54 PM
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When I just bought my car, on way home I stuck in middle of motorway with red cog. Car was under dealer warranty, first they replaced pump motor, no luck, on my second attempt to get home I stuck again nearly at same place around 20 miles away from dealers. Second attempt was to replace pressure accumulator, car was fine for first 50miles and then red cog again. I was about to demand my money back, but i just really want to have this sepang bronze. On third attempt they rebuild pump with new seal kit from above online shop and since then my SMG works like Swiss clocks.

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post #3 of 18 Old 14th April 2019, 07:44 PM
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@Ferris do you have more pics from SMG hydraulic pump? What torque spec you used for pump bolts, 5Nm? I'm going to overhaul my SMG next month so every tips and pointers are more than welcome.

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post #4 of 18 Old 14th April 2019, 07:44 PM
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Current mods: Short shifter, Custom clutch stop, Alpha-N + Power tuning by Evolve, AP coilovers, HEL brake lines.

Last edited by J.R ///M5; 14th April 2019 at 07:46 PM. Reason: Double
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post #5 of 18 Old 15th April 2019, 02:16 AM Thread Starter
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5NM is the correct spec from what I can tell for the bolt size and from Burkhart.

I only have one other pic.. see attached

Just remember it flows bigger to smaller. if you get stuck I can talk you through it.

The only advice I can give is make sure the seals are seated right, they sit in a grove, keep it as clean as possible, lint free paper towels ftw I personally oiled up the seal as well as oiled up the gears with fluid and added a bit into the intake chamber after.

After the pump, motor and res was together I removed the accumulator and applied 12v to the pump in short cycles ~ 1 second on time till it drew fluid and it came out the accumulator hole.
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2001 E36/7 MRoadster
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post #6 of 18 Old 15th April 2019, 06:06 PM
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Is that right? 150 euros for 5 orings? I know Jim has said he's not willing to sell these, but for that price he might be swayed... Just saying.
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post #7 of 18 Old 15th April 2019, 06:15 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flacoramos View Post
Is that right? 150 euros for 5 orings? I know Jim has said he's not willing to sell these, but for that price he might be swayed... Just saying.
I've seen a versions from Taiwan, on ebay ,for 80 iirc. As long as you're not having cavitation in the pump, these would be the only parts to fail as far as the pump goes. So it's a small price to pay and a lot cheaper than the 5k BMW wants for new hydraulics...

..of course with that you get new valves , a sensor strip, and tank which are the next biggest gotchas.

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post #8 of 18 Old 15th April 2019, 06:32 PM
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I've seen a versions from Taiwan, on ebay ,
Exactly why I haven't bothered with them
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post #9 of 18 Old 15th April 2019, 07:09 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by flacoramos View Post
Exactly why I haven't bothered with them
I wouldn't be surprised if they all come from the same source. The ebays are also 150 us, btw but then I saw mysteries from CA for 80. Who knows , if I cared enough I'd buy a spare pump install them and test them out. OTOH, Summer is coming and if i ever have to play this game again I'd probably just manual convert it or drive it into the Atlantic whatever is easier.

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post #10 of 18 Old 4th May 2019, 06:22 PM Thread Starter
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Wanted to throw a quick follow up and observations. Now that I replaced my Real main I've got a chance to do a lot more observations in inpa.

I wish I had a chance or at least forethought to log some data when the car was new. Now, after the rebuild, though there is little to no pressure drop when cruising in the same gear or over night. The pump rarely kicks on when opening the door or unlocking, Also it looks once the clutch is pushed in , ie at a light, there is hardly any pressure bleed. As we'd expect pressure drops when gears or the clutch moves. Also pressure builds right away right after the pump kicks on.

These are merely just data points , I wish I knew earlier. I may try to get testo to log all this so we can get into a spreadsheet.

2001 E36/7 MRoadster
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