Vanos solenoids || 3 way cure! Warm Idle, Highway cruise, low end response/tq - BMW M5 Forum and M6 Forums
E60 M5 and E61 M5 Touring Discussion 2005- Advertiser's Forum

 19Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 1 votes, 5.00 average. Display Modes
post #1 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 02:49 AM Thread Starter
5soko
Moderator
 
5soko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: NYC
Posts: 2,132
Thanks: 112
Thanked 284 Times in 218 Posts
Vanos solenoids || 3 way cure! Warm Idle, Highway cruise, low end response/tq

Hey guys,

So finally was able to tackle the vanos solenoids on my car and install 4 new ones to replace the 'not ok' tested one's, at a hefty price as all of you know they have increased in the past 2 years.

This wont be a DIY as there are two great DIY on the forum for that but ill just add in my notes here..
A quick summary would be the job isnt that bad, but time consuming getting those damn small screws out, the pass side is the real challenge, getting the screws back in and tight!




Install begins!
I left the rad in the car, as the damn one time use clamps were being a pain in the *** to remove in the tight space, so i just left it.. I did drain the coolant and remove the two big rad hoses on the passenger side.
I do want to demove the rad to clean up all the built up debri over the years, so that project will come another day, i was just excited to get the solenoids installed lol


Lemme repeat, PASS side vanos solenoids are a PAIN IN THE ***!!!! You need alot of patience and small torx tools to get the screws out but another challenge to get them back in

View of the old pass side solenoids,


Not much room to work with here


Driver side, brand new solenoids installed


Two vanos solenoids removed, and o-rings removed


1 brand new vanos solenoid installed, and one o-ring installed ready for solenoid install


So what did the vanos solenoids do for me!
Well after Iinstalled them, i added a 45/55 mix of oem bmw coolant and distilled water, bleed the cooling system, and then i did the vanos system 18 minute bleed procedure one time only.. My results are below of the vanos solenoid test, all showing OK and 0.80+












REAL WORLD RESULTS:
So what has changed in terms of performance with a failed vanos solenoid (NOT OK) vs a working one (OK)?

Warm startup idle flucuation:
Since i bought my car, if i shut my car off after a drive and come back 5-10-30-60 mins later to re-start her while she was warm, i was met with a idle that fluctuated 400-500 rpms up and down for about 5 minutes and then it would go away and car would idle normal.

During that time, esp if you have exhaust, it can be very annoying. In NYC everyone is always looking over like wtf? lol Plus it makes clutch engagement annoying during this time. Its a short period but still annoyed me such a expensive and beautiful car does this

SO i have chased this issue by changing out my gas tank vapor canister, no help..
Changed out the 2 gas tank vent valves, no help.
Checked all vacuum lines, secondary air channels, all 4 actuators, etc..

Have checked for error codes every other drive, changed gas stations, flashed to stock and diff tunes, changed oil, air filters, spark plugs, etc no help!

I can finally say the failed vanos solenoid has caused this issue and the new vanos solenoid i have installed have 100% cured this warm idle fluctuation for me and i couldn't be happier!

What really pinpointed that it was the solenoids at fault?! DATALOGGING!
Here is a datalog while my car was doing this warm idle fluctuation. As you can see the solenoids, esp the exhaust, was dipping and following the RPM dips and rises during this warm idle phase while all other parameters were staying solid for the most part!

RPM is grey, exhaust solenoid is pink, and intake solenoid is purple



Here is a video that correalates with the log above and of a warm start idle flucuation i was getting with the old vanos solenoids:


So if anyone is having a idle fluctuation on a warm start with no errors stored, i would start by data logging during that period to see what parameters are in sync with the rpm dips and rises, and test your vanos solenoids via inpa, dis...

Here is a video of my warm start idle with my new vanos solenoids:


-Highway cruise drone, tone changes/fluctuations

Sometimes when i was on the highway steady cruising say 70mph in 7th gear on partial throttle, my exhaust tone would flucuate with no influence to the throttle, the tone would get deeper and go back to normal every few seconds..

Well im happy to say the vanos solenoid were at fault here too, and the new ones have solved this!

-Low end throttle response, tq increase, smoothness

Well the low end response at low rpms has gotten alot better! now it feels like 380 ft lb engine, and there is no more lag in response and abrupt rush of power once i got to mid range rpm's. its nice, smooth and linear

As always, big shout out to Jim @jcolley , Bill @B767capt , and Steve @Mcc420

Last edited by 5soko; 25th May 2016 at 10:41 PM.
5soko is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to 5soko For This Useful Post:
dt646 (26th May 2016)
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 03:49 AM
Mcc420
Member, P500, DSC On (>600)
 
Mcc420's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Montreal
Posts: 685
Thanks: 24
Thanked 32 Times in 30 Posts
Mcc420 is offline  
post #3 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 02:22 PM
dr_dirtg
Addicted Member (>300 posts)
 
dr_dirtg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: north
Posts: 394
Thanks: 55
Thanked 18 Times in 17 Posts
This is great great news and information!
I suspect mine are causing low end torque and even a misfire when engine is cold.
I don't plan to change them until I do the rod bearings.
dr_dirtg is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to dr_dirtg For This Useful Post:
Falco (12th July 2016)
 
post #4 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 02:23 PM
dr_dirtg
Addicted Member (>300 posts)
 
dr_dirtg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: north
Posts: 394
Thanks: 55
Thanked 18 Times in 17 Posts
that data log is that on the old valves? or on new?
Is that on a warm engine?
Do you have a before and after data log that you could share so we see what it's supposed to look like?
dr_dirtg is offline  
post #5 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 03:00 PM
douglas_ngo
m5board.comoholic (>1000 posts)
 
douglas_ngo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: GA
Posts: 1,460
Thanks: 12
Thanked 96 Times in 89 Posts
Great review. I didn't know that you bought all new solenoids, thought you were able to clean your old ones. The passenger side is definitely a PITA to do but I am a pro now since I have done that job multiple times. Patience and take lot of short breaks. My back hurts every time I do that job. Not sure how miles on your car but you should have replace all the radiator hoses while doing this job. I replaced all four hoses as a PM.
douglas_ngo is offline  
post #6 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 04:21 PM
jcolley
M5 Expert (>4000)
 
jcolley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Maine
Posts: 5,658
Thanks: 77
Thanked 1,264 Times in 872 Posts
A helpful tip on VANOS solenoid connectors if your einlass/ausslass labels are missing

- each connector has a positive and a ground connector
- the black wire is obviously ground
- green or red is the positive wire

- green is cooler than red. green is intake, red is exhaust.

You're welcome.
jcolley is online now  
post #7 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 04:29 PM Thread Starter
5soko
Moderator
 
5soko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: NYC
Posts: 2,132
Thanks: 112
Thanked 284 Times in 218 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_dirtg View Post
that data log is that on the old valves? or on new?
Is that on a warm engine?
Do you have a before and after data log that you could share so we see what it's supposed to look like?
That datalog is on idle, on a warm start... Yes, that is on the old failed valves... As you can see the RPM followed the solenoid movement, esp the exhaust, move for move, so that clearly showed the solenoid was effecting the idle.. (Or vanos system)
I dont have a datalog of the new valves specifically but this is how the log should look, idle/rpm steady and both intake and exhaust solenoid valves holding their respective values steady aswell...



I also added a video in my first thread under the log showing how my idle looked and how it correalates to the datalog

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_dirtg View Post
This is great great news and information!
I suspect mine are causing low end torque and even a misfire when engine is cold.
I don't plan to change them until I do the rod bearings.
Yea this engine def loves a good running vanos solenoids..

Quote:
Originally Posted by douglas_ngo View Post
Great review. I didn't know that you bought all new solenoids, thought you were able to clean your old ones. The passenger side is definitely a PITA to do but I am a pro now since I have done that job multiple times. Patience and take lot of short breaks. My back hurts every time I do that job. Not sure how miles on your car but you should have replace all the radiator hoses while doing this job. I replaced all four hoses as a PM.
Thanks alot! Yea, i had no choice unfortunately except to get 4 new ones... I couldnt get the old ones to pass, i cleaned them and put 9v to them and everything... Bleed them numerous times, reset adaptions.. Haha my back was hurting for 48hrs after the fact! Thanks to these solenoids, I have a bad back at the age of 27 now..
I have 45K miles on her, i did check and all hoses looked very good condition for now..
But man, im not sure i wanna tackle this job again in the future lol

Last edited by 5soko; 25th May 2016 at 04:52 PM.
5soko is offline  
post #8 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 04:49 PM Thread Starter
5soko
Moderator
 
5soko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: NYC
Posts: 2,132
Thanks: 112
Thanked 284 Times in 218 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcolley View Post
A helpful tip on VANOS solenoid connectors if your einlass/ausslass labels are missing

- each connector has a positive and a ground connector
- the black wire is obviously ground
- green or red is the positive wire

- green is cooler than red. green is intake, red is exhaust.

You're welcome.
Funny you add this, i didnt know which went where when i was re-connecting things and When i searched, I found a old thread you posted in explaing which go where!

Jim maybe you might have the answers to this, i only bleed the system once and its smooth/quiet.. Should i still bleed another round?
My quality values are mostly in the 0.80's range, which i have seen alot of guys with new solenoids get, ive only seen anazfin get in the high 90's lol


Also, vanos oil pressure doesn't increase during the bleeding procedure outside of normal operation correct? Its only opening and closing of the solenoids during the bleeding process..

Last edited by 5soko; 25th May 2016 at 04:52 PM.
5soko is offline  
post #9 of 30 Old 25th May 2016, 10:58 PM
DB EJ6
Member, Sport: On DSC: On (>100 posts)
 
DB EJ6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: LI, NY
Posts: 127
Thanks: 3
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
5soko, I would love to meet up with you some time and do some datalogging... @jcolley can vouch for me. I have been to his shop for my bearings

-2007 Sepang Bronze Metallic M5


"The E60's V10 is like dating that hot girl who takes you for granted, makes you buy her stuff all the time, the sex is mindblowing and she screams too loud during the act , mother never approved of her, and she got too drunk at your wedding and made out with the best man." -- BMWDave
DB EJ6 is offline  
post #10 of 30 Old 26th May 2016, 12:58 AM
dt646
Member, Sport: Off DSC: On (>50 posts)
 
dt646's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: NY
Posts: 80
Thanks: 5
Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
dt646 is offline  
Reply

Bookmarks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the BMW M5 Forum and M6 Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Linear Mode Linear Mode
Rate This Thread:



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rough idle and low on power after VANOS issues Minion E39 M5 and E52 Z8 Discussion 9 12th June 2012 12:01 AM
Low end throttle response and torque ClintLewis E60 M5 and E61 M5 Touring Discussion 16 5th July 2011 07:18 PM
Hopefully, some helpful info... [resolving low end hesitation and poor idle quality] Pwdrhead1711 E39 M5 and E52 Z8 Discussion 4 28th May 2007 05:56 PM
M5 on Great Basin Highway = Cure for Low Blood Pressure M5 Cowboy E60 M5 and E61 M5 Touring Discussion 12 4th April 2006 07:20 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome