Tips and Tricks for Diagnosing a bad CPS that's not throwing codes - BMW M5 Forum and M6 Forums
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post #1 of 15 Old 20th June 2019, 06:59 PM Thread Starter
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Tips and Tricks for Diagnosing a bad CPS that's not throwing codes

Hey fellas,

For awhile now my car has been feeling a bit "low on power" when I stomp on it. Nothing drastic occurs other than the fact that when I demand the power, it feels sub-par and definitely not where this 400HP rocket sled should be.

I have been reading and thinking about this for awhile and have read that it could be either soft failing bad MAF's or bad CPSs that are also soft failing but neither one throws a code.

I read that if your MAFs are bad, and you unplug them and drive around, the car may act significantly better, so I did this test on mine. Identical to before and after so I feel the MAF's are fine.

So this thread is about how you can test to see if your CPSs are functioning properly or soft failing when they are NOT tossing a code.

1) My only option thus far is to pull them, check to see visually if they are the older or newer style, then at least I will know if they have been updated at some point or not.

I have a Schwaben BMW code reader that is capable of doing some real-time reading of various values, but which ones might help diagnose a bad or all bad CPSs?

Exhaust is a bit "blatty" recently when I really dig into it, but I am concerned this might be my X pipe rattling against my gas tank heat shield as it was incredibly close when I installed and I need to inspect this more closely.

Any other ideas or words of wisdom to check the CPSs for potential soft fail when they are not generating codes and the car just feels down on power?

Thanks!

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post #2 of 15 Old 20th June 2019, 07:20 PM Thread Starter
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Here is an example of my "blatty" exhaust sound at WOT while I drive under a bridge for reference:

https://youtu.be/bK_ZfYtiZmM

man, the "blattyness" didn't really translate too good from my phone to youtube... meh.

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Last edited by Trizzuth; 20th June 2019 at 07:21 PM.
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post #3 of 15 Old 20th June 2019, 07:33 PM Thread Starter
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Also - has anyone tried these "OE Supplier, aka OEM" units from FCP?

They're almost half the price of the Genuine BMW ones and this should be the same part with the logo shaved off... and they're also lifetime.. at that price, I would totally replace all 4...! I would normally ONLY buy Genuine BMW parts for something like the CPS, but if this is the same part with logo shaved off, I'm all game, esp with lifetime warranty.

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...z8-12147539173 (Intake Side)

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...em-13627796054 (Exhaust Side)

Also, are the 2 intake sensors the same part and the 2 exhaust sensors the same part, so only 2 part numbers, but 2 of each?

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Last edited by Trizzuth; 20th June 2019 at 07:35 PM.
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post #4 of 15 Old 21st June 2019, 02:31 AM
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Honestly, you're going to replace the CPSs once. Just buy OE. I don't buy the whole "it's the same as OE with logo shaved off" but that's just me, I guess. Electronics, electrics, sensors, I buy OE. I factor in how hard it is to get to the part on the car also. I might take a "risk" and buy another brand if it's a one bolt, top of the engine thing.

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post #5 of 15 Old 21st June 2019, 01:20 PM Thread Starter
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[YOUTUBE][/YOUTUBE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by josiahg52 View Post
Honestly, you're going to replace the CPSs once. Just buy OE. I don't buy the whole "it's the same as OE with logo shaved off" but that's just me, I guess. Electronics, electrics, sensors, I buy OE. I factor in how hard it is to get to the part on the car also. I might take a "risk" and buy another brand if it's a one bolt, top of the engine thing.
Honestly, for the past 15 years working on BMWs, I have never one single time had an issue using an OE part that simply had the BMW logo shaved off, and there's no reason you should have some strange "fear" of this either. It is LITERALLY the same exact part BMW would have sold themselves, but likely had overstock and thus allows the original manufacturer to re-sell the parts, but cannot do this with their logo as that is what proves it is a genuine BMW component (AKA allows them to double charge you).

That being said, FCP clearly states on their website that Original Equipment (OE) Parts: These are the same parts originally supplied to dealerships, except with the dealer logos removed. This is done by manufacturers so the parts can be sold outside the dealer network due to licensing agreements.

and that OEM parts are:

Original Equipment Manufacturer (OEM) Parts: These are produced by a manufacturer that supplies at least one OE part to a vehicle manufacturer. OEM parts may not have been original to the car, but are held to higher-quality standards and stringent quality control.

On their website for these alternate CPSs, they are listed as "OEM" which means not shaved logo original parts and that has me sketched a bit as I typically don't use these unless they are an easy to get to item.

So my conundrum is this:
1) My car is not tossing any codes currently
2) My car simply feels "down on power" sometimes at WOT
3) My car is an 03 model with 98,000 miles - unsure if the CPSs were ever changed.
4) So I have no immediate reason to buy these other than my theory that it is impacting the power at WOT, and that they may be the older design.
5) At some point I will need to do a valve cover gasket change, which makes this entire job easier, so I may just deal with it then, but the unknown of this fixing my issue at WOT kills me.
6) I may e-mail FCP and see what exact brand this OEM part is, as there are quite a few reviews on the site that these parts are legit, and not to mention LIFETIME warranty. So if they did not
work for some reason, yes I have to do the job again. Yes that sucks. Yes I have always bought Genuine BMW parts for anything electric as otherwise you typically have issues.
7) There is a significant cost difference between the OEM and Original parts, $306.96 vs $664.32 for Genuine parts!!!!

These are not the good ol $100 a pop they used to be. It's MORE THAN DOUBLE the price for Genuine. Hence my thought to go all in on the Lifetime "OEM" sensors here.

More thoughts?

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post #6 of 15 Old 21st June 2019, 07:38 PM Thread Starter
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Just a note of reference here:

Tischer has the Genuine BMW sensors (albeit with no lifetime warranty) for a total of $558.88 almost $100 in savings over FCP, man are they charging you for that lifetime warranty now or what??

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post #7 of 15 Old 21st June 2019, 07:45 PM
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Which ever you decide to put in is your choice, just replace them. It is a ton of work to replace them, more than I would do to inspect them. Cheapest easiest way would be order one side then change them out. If you find you had a new style you could skip ordering that one for the next side. With all the cars I have had I have a few new style sitting in the box but did not reuse them. The $ savings is not worth the work to do the job again. Once finished all four your reaction will likely be thank god that is over and done with!
BTW it could be your butt dyno is out of whack, the more you drive them the less powerful they seem.

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post #8 of 15 Old 21st June 2019, 09:11 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailor24 View Post
Which ever you decide to put in is your choice, just replace them. It is a ton of work to replace them, more than I would do to inspect them. Cheapest easiest way would be order one side then change them out. If you find you had a new style you could skip ordering that one for the next side. With all the cars I have had I have a few new style sitting in the box but did not reuse them. The $ savings is not worth the work to do the job again. Once finished all four your reaction will likely be thank god that is over and done with!
BTW it could be your butt dyno is out of whack, the more you drive them the less powerful they seem.
This is great advice. Especially since I have no codes now, it's quite possible that my butt dyno has been adjusted and it does not feel as fast anymore. But what kills me is that there are definitely times when it feels FASTER than it is at other times!

argh. I may hang back for now. Been reading all about the vanos solenoids sticking and may decide to crack the cover on these and see if there are any leaks, but again, zero codes related to any of this.

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post #9 of 15 Old 21st June 2019, 10:15 PM
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Maybe not fear, but mistrust. I fully believe that the shaved parts were manufactured for BMW and I've pondered here and elsewhere in a parts source diatribe of mine that they're probably legitimate overstock. I also wonder if they might be excess inventory that failed some specific BMW test or have some blemish? I only consider that because those type of parts exist - legitimately - in my industry. Sometimes we risk using these parts but are told exactly what we're purchasing and what we might expect. I don't know about these shaved parts and none of the suppliers are forthcoming on exactly their status.

Plenty of people have used the shaved parts and OEM with good results. My opinion shouldn't necessarily convince you one way or another. I offer it as a perspective too consider. I bought mine in 2013 and they were less than $100 each and I think there was a less than $50 difference in the total price between OE and the next quality OEM. Times and situations change.

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post #10 of 15 Old 21st June 2019, 11:29 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by josiahg52 View Post
Maybe not fear, but mistrust. I fully believe that the shaved parts were manufactured for BMW and I've pondered here and elsewhere in a parts source diatribe of mine that they're probably legitimate overstock. I also wonder if they might be excess inventory that failed some specific BMW test or have some blemish? I only consider that because those type of parts exist - legitimately - in my industry. Sometimes we risk using these parts but are told exactly what we're purchasing and what we might expect. I don't know about these shaved parts and none of the suppliers are forthcoming on exactly their status.

Plenty of people have used the shaved parts and OEM with good results. My opinion shouldn't necessarily convince you one way or another. I offer it as a perspective too consider. I bought mine in 2013 and they were less than $100 each and I think there was a less than $50 difference in the total price between OE and the next quality OEM. Times and situations change.


Yeah I personally replaced the ones in my e46 330i with a Genuine set I would say prior to 100k miles, and never once touched them again until that car suffered a total loss at the hands of an old lady who’s foot slipped off the brake and landed on the gas as she careened into me out of a parking lot. That car had 236,000 when that happened so all my confidence is in the genuine part.

No codes bothers me too. I detest chasing problems on BMWs by replacing as much as you can and start to narrow it down, bern there and fine that, if it were a more severe issue, then I’d be all in. Tough at this point to know where to go.


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