can Motec/Bosch etc. ECU coexist with instrument cluster control unit? - BMW M5 Forum and M6 Forums
E39 M5 and E52 Z8 Discussion 1998-2003 Advertiser's Forum

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post #1 of 27 Old 21st September 2017, 10:13 PM Thread Starter
toobs1234
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can Motec/Bosch etc. ECU coexist with instrument cluster control unit?

Has anyone managed to install a motorsport ECU (Motec/Bosch etc.) and had it coexist with the stock instrument cluster ECU? I'd really like to install a Motec M1, but keeping the stock instrument cluster functional is a must for me. I imagine that the instrument cluster should only need to access a few sensor values over the CAN bus (rpm, wheel speed, oil pressure, etc.) which shouldn't be too difficult in theory. I would be in way over my head if I tried to do it, though.

I would really appreciate a reference to a pro with BMW experience who could help me out with this if you know someone.

thanks a lot, John

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post #2 of 27 Old 21st September 2017, 10:34 PM Thread Starter
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As you can see from the diagram, the DME is relatively isolated from the rest of the control system and only communicates over CAN. Seems like it should be possible, but the devil is in the details.
Attached Thumbnails
Z8 bus system.jpg  

Dinan high flow MAF sensors
Dinan enlarged throttle bodies
Dinan headers
Dinan lightweight flywheel
Dinan by Brembo brakes
Dinan control arm monoball bushings
Dinan adjustable anti-sway bar
BBS Forged Individual wheels
KW Competition monotube dampers
KW adjustable monoball mounts
Meisterschaft titanium exhaust
Quaife limited slip differential
3.64:1 final drive

Last edited by toobs1234; 21st September 2017 at 10:36 PM.
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post #3 of 27 Old 21st September 2017, 10:35 PM
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Are you set on Motec? There's another option from another tuner; a full standalone that's plug and play and works the stock cluster. Infinite customization just like any good standalone too.

pavlotech

-Shady H.
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post #4 of 27 Old 21st September 2017, 10:47 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by TheShafro View Post
Are you set on Motec?
Not set on Motec, but two things I would like to implement are water injection and shift automation, both of which can be done with the Motec M1. That said, keeping the rest of the electrical system functioning is a must for me.

thanks a lot for the link!

Dinan high flow MAF sensors
Dinan enlarged throttle bodies
Dinan headers
Dinan lightweight flywheel
Dinan by Brembo brakes
Dinan control arm monoball bushings
Dinan adjustable anti-sway bar
BBS Forged Individual wheels
KW Competition monotube dampers
KW adjustable monoball mounts
Meisterschaft titanium exhaust
Quaife limited slip differential
3.64:1 final drive
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post #5 of 27 Old 22nd September 2017, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toobs1234 View Post
Not set on Motec, but two things I would like to implement are water injection and shift automation, both of which can be done with the Motec M1. That said, keeping the rest of the electrical system functioning is a must for me.

thanks a lot for the link!
Peter, @herrubermensch , is the only person I know that's running (or will run lol) Motec, and I know he's had to build a bunch of wiring. But he's also deleted half the modules in his car, IKE included.

Pavlotech is the only solution I know that will be as close to PNP for this car/engine as possible.

-Shady H.
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post #6 of 27 Old 22nd September 2017, 09:36 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShafro View Post
Pavlotech is the only solution I know that will be as close to PNP for this car/engine as possible.
Thanks a lot for the link! I had a chance to take a closer look and that's a pretty cool product. Seems a lot of work went into interfacing with the rest of the car, which would not be feasible for a one-off project.

The Emtron ECU they use has water control and full closed loop shift control, so it's perfect!

Dinan high flow MAF sensors
Dinan enlarged throttle bodies
Dinan headers
Dinan lightweight flywheel
Dinan by Brembo brakes
Dinan control arm monoball bushings
Dinan adjustable anti-sway bar
BBS Forged Individual wheels
KW Competition monotube dampers
KW adjustable monoball mounts
Meisterschaft titanium exhaust
Quaife limited slip differential
3.64:1 final drive

Last edited by toobs1234; 22nd September 2017 at 11:52 AM.
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post #7 of 27 Old 22nd September 2017, 05:50 PM
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post #8 of 27 Old 23rd September 2017, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toobs1234 View Post
Thanks a lot for the link! I had a chance to take a closer look and that's a pretty cool product. Seems a lot of work went into interfacing with the rest of the car, which would not be feasible for a one-off project.

The Emtron ECU they use has water control and full closed loop shift control, so it's perfect!
Emtron is a great plug and play solution, and the people behind it are good people. That said, it does not even compare to the power and flexibility of a Motec M190. The M1 series ECUs essentially allow you to do whatever you want--you write you own firmware either from scratch or modify the code of an existing package. Knowing your project, John, I think you want the M190. It absolutely can be made to interface with the stock cluster. I know the guy who successfully married the E46 cluster and a Motec M150 and can hook you up. The M190 will take more time to install and program, but will be infinitely more fun and flexible in the long run. And you would get the benefit of all the work I have done in getting it to work with an S62!

Best,

Peter
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post #9 of 27 Old 23rd September 2017, 12:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShafro View Post
Peter, @herrubermensch , is the only person I know that's running (or will run lol) Motec, and I know he's had to build a bunch of wiring. But he's also deleted half the modules in his car, IKE included.

Pavlotech is the only solution I know that will be as close to PNP for this car/engine as possible.
I think that's correct. The AEM Infinity probably falls somewhere between the Motec and the Emtron in terms of its PNP qualities.

I deleted all my modules and all the related crap wiring in both my M5 and my M3. Running an M190 in both now!

--Peter
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post #10 of 27 Old 23rd September 2017, 01:53 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herrubermensch View Post
I know the guy who successfully married the E46 cluster and a Motec M150 and can hook you up.
Please do hook me up, Peter. I would love to have the ability to write my own strategies. I would also LOVE to realize maximum benefit from your pathbreaking activities! I have too much on my plate, though, to be getting into bus protocol details.

If it can be done for an E46, I suppose it will also be possible for the Z8. The MSS54 and MSS52 are pretty similar and probably use the same formats, but perhaps different addresses.

thanks again, John

Dinan high flow MAF sensors
Dinan enlarged throttle bodies
Dinan headers
Dinan lightweight flywheel
Dinan by Brembo brakes
Dinan control arm monoball bushings
Dinan adjustable anti-sway bar
BBS Forged Individual wheels
KW Competition monotube dampers
KW adjustable monoball mounts
Meisterschaft titanium exhaust
Quaife limited slip differential
3.64:1 final drive
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