BMW's Oil Viscosity changes. (quick question) - BMW M5 Forum and M6 Forums
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post #1 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 07:08 PM Thread Starter
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BMW's Oil Viscosity changes. (quick question)

I haven't changed my oil since 8/2014 (only driven 800 miles since then) and just went to the dealership to purchase oil and a filter. The parts manager said they no longer sell 5/30 and that their 0/30 formula is "backwards compatible" and that it will be fine with my engine. For 13 years now I have always used 5/30 since thats what the sticker on my engine bay says to do (never used 10/60). I religiously send it out to Blackstone for analysis and have always had a clean bill of health.

Just making sure what he told me about 0/30 being ok to use is actually true.

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post #2 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 07:43 PM
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Lots of places sell 5W-30 oil, if that is what you want to run. The warranty is long expired so there is no reason to use oil sourced from the dealer, especially if they are changing the requirements. Do you think they actually tested the 0W-30 in an S62 engine to determine it was OK?

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post #3 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 07:50 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gzig5 View Post
Lots of places sell 5W-30 oil, if that is what you want to run. The warranty is long expired so there is no reason to use oil sourced from the dealer, especially if they are changing the requirements. Do you think they actually tested the 0W-30 in an S62 engine to determine it was OK?
Right. I can find the BMW branded 5w/30 online in several places and have it tomorrow. I guess I was just wondering if anyone else had heard this or if any of it's actually true. Are the online vendors just selling old stock 5/30? The guy was listing his credentials being the parts manager for 15+ years, but it didn't make me feel any better.

I stick with BMW oil since I am a creature of habit and have had very few issues with this car, ever. Plus, with the BMWCCA discount its usually cheaper for me than any oil I can get elsewhere.

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post #4 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 07:59 PM
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You guys are discussing the viscosity designation of the oil and nothing else. Keep that in mind. The additive package that does the most work to protect your engine is the same.

The service manager is technically correct that 0W-30 is backwards compatible with 5W-30. For starters, the low temp (winter) viscosity is lower (0W vs 5W). This means the oil flows better at low temperature giving you better cold start lubrication. Because the viscosity ratings are given at two temperatures, the viscosity vs temperature curve of the 0W-30 is steeper than the 5W-30 curve. In simple terms, it means 0W will also have higher viscosity at extreme operating temperatures.
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post #5 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 08:12 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seabass23 View Post
You guys are discussing the viscosity designation of the oil and nothing else. Keep that in mind. The additive package that does the most work to protect your engine is the same.

The service manager is technically correct that 0W-30 is backwards compatible with 5W-30. For starters, the low temp (winter) viscosity is lower (0W vs 5W). This means the oil flows better at low temperature giving you better cold start lubrication. Because the viscosity ratings are given at two temperatures, the viscosity vs temperature curve of the 0W-30 is steeper than the 5W-30 curve. In simple terms, it means 0W will also have higher viscosity at extreme operating temperatures.

Obviously, my car sits a lot and still has relatively low mileage (75k). I do experience my lifters making a clicking sound if I don't start the car for a few months at a time. That noise is always gone by the time the car gets up to temp and I have had 10-15 minutes to really drive it. Would the 0-30 rating help that issue?


I am guessing from what you said that I should not be concerned with using 0/30 vs the 5/30 my mind tells me the car needs.

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post #6 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 08:40 PM
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BMW uses Shell oils now rather than Castrol. BMW still brands a 5-30 if you want to use it: Original BMW Accessories : Accessory finder

Ever since the TIS was released stating that BMW Castrol 10-60 OR 5-30 could be used in E39 M5s produced after the bearing change in 2/2000 (I think the TIS was released in 2006), I have been using Castrol 10-60 (prior to the TIS, the dealer would only use 5-30 because that is what the sticker says, and the car was covered under the BMW maintenance program). While Castrol is no longer the BMW supplier, I still use Castrol TWS 10-60 and I imagine you can also still buy the Castrol "German" formulation of 5-30.

Of course, any number of oils will be fine, such a Mobil 1 0-40, etc. BTW, the BMW/Shell 0-30 is what is being used in my F80 M3.

P.S. It's nice to have a good old-fashioned oil thread here...it's been far to long!

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Last edited by KevinM; 14th December 2016 at 08:41 PM.
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post #7 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3rd One View Post
Obviously, my car sits a lot and still has relatively low mileage (75k). I do experience my lifters making a clicking sound if I don't start the car for a few months at a time. That noise is always gone by the time the car gets up to temp and I have had 10-15 minutes to really drive it. Would the 0-30 rating help that issue?


I am guessing from what you said that I should not be concerned with using 0/30 vs the 5/30 my mind tells me the car needs.
I personally would CHOOSE to run 0W-30 in any of my vehicles rated for 5W-30. To me it's the obvious upgrade since it provides better cold start performance AND better extreme temperature performance.
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post #8 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seabass23 View Post
I personally would CHOOSE to run 0W-30 in any of my vehicles rated for 5W-30. To me it's the obvious upgrade since it provides better cold start performance AND the same, all else equal extreme temperature performance.
Fixed that for you.

But, agreed. I run my car on 0w-40, for the cold start decreased wear. I run German Castrol, because it's BMW LL01 approved (unlike M1 0w-40, as of a couple months ago). I run the 0w-40 because it splits the hot thickness between the two weights BMW specs (30 and 60, but the 60 shears to a 50 almost immediately) and I am unlikely to ever track the M5 (where the TWS weight could become necessary).

All else equal (not necessarily the case, but for the purpose of discussing oils weights in isolation), a 0w-30 provides superior performance in lower temperature cold starts and equal performance at operating temperature. It is not, all else equal, any thinner at operating temperature (common misconception).

A thinner oil (e.g. 30 weight) actually provides superior wear protection than a thicker oil (e.g. 60 weight), right until it (suddenly, catastrophically) doesn't. A thinner oil also improves fuel economy and horsepower. The best oil to run is the thinnest you can get away with, but never exceed, for your usage set. Then, weight selected, get one that's approved for use in your car (for BMW's of our era, that mean LL01 approved, which it'll say on the back of the bottle).

Last edited by Obioban; 15th December 2016 at 04:25 PM.
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post #9 of 100 Old 14th December 2016, 10:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obioban View Post
Fixed that for you.

But, agreed. I run my car on 0w-40, for the cold start decreased wear. I run German Castrol, because it's BMW LL01 approved (unlike M1 0w-40, as of a couple months ago). I run the 0w-40 because it splits the hot thickness between the two weights BMW specs (30 and 60, but the 60 shears to a 50 almost immediately) and I am unlikely to ever track the M5 (where the TWS weight could become necessary).

All else equal (not necessarily the case, but for the purpose of discussing oils weights in isolation), a 0w-30 provides superior performance in lower temperature cold starts and equal performance at operating temperature. It is not, all else equal, any thinner at operating temperature (common misconception).

A thinner oil (e.g. 30 weight) actually provides superior wear protection than a thicker oil (e.g. 60 weight), right until it (suddenly, catastrophically) doesn't. A thinner oil also improves fuel economy and horsepower. The best oil to run is the thinnest you can get away with, but never exceed, for your usage set. Then, weight selected, get one that's approved for use in your car (for BMW's, that mean LL01 approved, which it'll say on the back of the bottle).

I stand by my original wording. At extreme temperatures (ABOVE normal operating), the 0W-30 provides BETTER protection. If you graphed viscosity vs. temperature on a log scale, you'd create two straight lines. Both lines would pass through the same viscosity at operating temperature but the cold start viscosity is lower for the 0W-30, therefore creating a flatter sloped line. As a result, your viscosity at extreme temperatures is HIGHER with 0W-30 than it is with 5W-30.

Last edited by seabass23; 14th December 2016 at 10:57 PM.
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post #10 of 100 Old 15th December 2016, 05:57 AM
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Are people actually discussing and comparing oils based on the labeled viscosity range?!?!

the "0"...the '5'..the '30'????

Pretty funny.

I would never use oil thinner than the BMW HiPo 5w30 (which was close to a 5w40)... I run 10-60

I dont know the specs on BMWs new 0-30, but OP is wise to question BMW parts clerks.

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Last edited by ard; 15th December 2016 at 05:59 AM.
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