Oil thread with Lab Analyst - Page 24 - BMW M5 Forum and M6 Forums
E34 M5 Discussion 1988-1995 Sedan and Touring

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post #231 of 240 Old 1st May 2016, 05:32 PM
GregT53
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I did have the same concern about the potential to cause seals to leak. I have not noticed an increase in leakage from the original pan seal. It is described as a semi-synthetic. Not sure exactly what this means concerning the formulation. I plan to use Brad Penn again on the next change and for continuity I will service at the same mileage and get another Blackstone report to help make the best comparison to Valvoline.
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post #232 of 240 Old 1st May 2016, 05:32 PM
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I did have the same concern about the potential to cause seals to leak. I have not noticed an increase in leakage from the original pan seal. It is described as a semi-synthetic. Not sure exactly what this means concerning the formulation. I plan to use Brad Penn again on the next change and for continuity I will service at the same mileage and get another Blackstone report to help make the best comparison to Valvoline.
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post #233 of 240 Old 12th July 2016, 04:52 PM
Eero H
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eero H View Post
Previously i use Teboil 10w-60, now NLA. Last summer i use Kendall 15w-40, also now NLA.

This years first drive outside temp was +0.5C. Last week i drove M5, max outside temp was +14C, average maybe +7C. I drive quite moderately, maybe once a year oil temp exceed +80C. This makes me wonder, should next oil be 5w-40/50? Maybe Mobil 5w-50, local M mechanics recommend that for S85.
I bought this
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post #234 of 240 Old 28th January 2017, 04:15 AM
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Latest analysis.

This makes a comparison between Valvoline VR-1 non-synthetic 20W-50 and Brad Penn semi-synthetic 20W-50 oils.

Noted in the report is the increase in iron which is likely due to several hard runs at sustained 5,000-6,500 RPM to blow off carbon.

Between the two oils, a point of interest is the flash point with the Brad Penn being below the desired value of greater than 385 F. The magnesium level is also quite elevated for Brad Penn. Other than these two measurements, it appears the Brad Penn has more favorable numbers, especially in the ZDDP department.

Thoughts?
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post #235 of 240 Old 27th April 2017, 05:22 PM
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The last documented UOA of my E34S M5 was performed in September 2015 at 191568km. This UOA already demonstrated elevated wear levels of copper, iron and lead, which pointed towards bearing wear.



Originally, it was planned to replace the conrod bearings in the winter of 2015/2016, however two other car related projects came in between due to which this was postponed to the winter of 2016 and 2017. In the past few months, we took on this project and replaced not only the conrod bearings, but (purely as a preventive measure) the oil pump as well.



When performing the engine rebuild of the M88/3 engine of my E28S M5, I paid less than 10 Euro for a single bearing shell. However that was in 2009. Nowadays in 2017, their retail price has more than tripled.



After some time being out of stock, BMW supplies the ‘short-type’ oil pump again, however these retail at over 500 Euro ex VAT nowadays, but bear in mind that this is a mission-critical part and a single point of failure as well so from that point of view, it is imperative to replace the old pump.



After removing the sump, the oil pump and the crankshaft became visible to the full extent for the first time in twenty-seven years. As can be seen, the bottom end has that nice brown varnish colour; the engine is completely free of insoluble and/or sludge, which is a clear testimony if regular and short term oil changes with high quality engine oil, at least during my watch (since April 1999).



From the historical documentation, it appears as if BK02837 was not given frequent oil changes during its first four years. This is however unlikely as she was then in the inventory of a BMW main service agent in Switzerland and not registered for the first time until June 1994. Given this status, it is very unlikely that in between the first service by Roseg in Pontresina and the first delivery in 1994, no oil changes were performed.



Even though some wear was expected after 195655 kilometres, the extend of which cannot be determined (and documented) without performing a visual inspection. If one takes a closer look to some of them, spot wear down to the steel substrate can be seen



The journals for the conrod of cylinders #1 and #3 showed some scoring marks. Fortunately, the scoring could not be felt and a light polish made them disappear.



Upon disassembly of the original oil-pump, only mild level of wear to its moving parts was observed. Based on its condition, it was perfectly defendable to reuse the old pump, however (1) from a risk management perspective and (2) the current market developments for E34S M5’s in good to excellent condition maintaining the old pump would have been the wrong decision, so it had to be replaced.



The outer rotor showed some scoring, which is normal for these (eaton) type of oil pumps because te pump is situated in between the sump and the filter and thus is subject to unfiltered oil from te sump and thus prone to elements of engine wear and dirt.



The short summary is that any well maintained S38B36 can suffer from conrod bearing wear. In my particular case, I think the engine would have lasted no more than 10k kilometres without dropping a rod. Granted, this particular engine saw some appropriate use during the 94016 kilometres that I have added since April 1999. Using a different type of oil would certainly not have delayed the bearing wear. On the contrary, using a low-weight oil would only have accelerated the bearing wear during the more stressful driving conditions (at least 50% of my kilometres).

Raymond

==> MY90 E34 M5 3.6 <==
==> MY85 E28 M5 M88/3 <==

The E34 M5 Alps tour. Sixth edition: 14-17 September 2007
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post #236 of 240 Old 29th April 2017, 07:27 AM
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post #237 of 240 Old 29th April 2017, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eero H View Post
You got stock size bearings and did not measure?
I did actually, but demonstrating the process (how to) is not the intention of my contribution, which was merely aimed to scientifically proove the usefullness of Used Oil Analysis as an early detection method for critical bearing wear.

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post #238 of 240 Old 21st March 2018, 06:08 AM
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Hi All,

I've got my first sample being tested at the moment but had a phone call today citing that the flash point test had revealed >5% petrol dilution in my oil.

Ever since getting the car back from having the MAF replaced and vac lines replaced it has not run 100%, performance is down and I'm wondering whether the above is a result of over fueling. It certainly seems to have a small vac leak and small stumble at idle.

I'll post the full results when I get them for your advice.

Cheers
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post #239 of 240 Old 21st March 2018, 02:55 PM
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Ok, got the report:

Oil:
PENTRITE HPR10
[email protected]: 131
[email protected]: 19
TBN: 7.5

Report:
Wear Metals ppm
lead: 6
iron: 12
aluminium: 2
copper: 2
chromium 1
tin: 1
nickel: 0

Contaminents ppm
silicon: 13
sodium: 1

Oil Additives ppm
magnesium: 190
zinc: 920
molybdenum: 47
calcium: 2255
phosphorous: 789
boron: 17

Infra Red
TBN: 6.80
soot: 3
glycol%: 0
Fuel dilution: 3%
water: 0
oxidation: 13
nitration: 9
sulphation: 18

Physical Tests:
water%: 0
PQ-90 mg/ltr: 1
[email protected]: 15.85
[email protected] 97.48

Comments:
3% Fuel Dilution detected, please check fuel delivery system.


This 3000kms has seen significant idling in peak traffic as well as a number of short trips.

I am going to change the oil to Penrite HPR15-60, a full synthetic with full zinc additive package.

They are recommending an additive called Nanolub WS2. Anyone heard of this one?

Company that did the oil analysis is Techenomics

Last edited by inertia8; 22nd March 2018 at 11:44 AM.
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post #240 of 240 Old 27th March 2018, 10:01 AM
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I found that I had another 6L bottle of the HPR10. Given all the wear metals looked good to me, I changed the oil and put in a new bmw filter and decided to change the air filter and spark plugs at the same time. I will dump it in 12 months or 2000kms.

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Last edited by inertia8; 27th March 2018 at 03:12 PM.
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