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Discussion Starter #1
Well my clutch is getting to that point, starting to not put the power down under hard shifts/high revs.

So I have a questions...The stock clutch is not covered under the warrenty correct?


What does the stock clutch cost, plus install TIME, since rates vary.


Has there been a final determination as to what after market clutch kit stands up to the stock power (and maybe headers down the road) with stock feel and NO NOISE! All i want to do is when it's really gone swap it out, not chip to raise the idle either, just the clutch.

thanks


by the way I searched and with over 20 pages I didnt' want to read it all.
 

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Shoot Rob at UUC a PM or an email and I'm sure he can sort you out.
There have been some cases of people getting new clutches under warranty, but that is usually the exception. Based upon what I have been hearing, going aftermarket is the best thing to do. Some of the first stage UUC setups should help without increasing roll over noise.
:cheers:
 

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Jayson said:
Well my clutch is getting to that point, starting to not put the power down under hard shifts/high revs.

So I have a questions...The stock clutch is not covered under the warrenty correct?


What does the stock clutch cost, plus install TIME, since rates vary.


Has there been a final determination as to what after market clutch kit stands up to the stock power (and maybe headers down the road) with stock feel and NO NOISE! All i want to do is when it's really gone swap it out, not chip to raise the idle either, just the clutch.

thanks


by the way I searched and with over 20 pages I didnt' want to read it all.
I think clutch is covered under the maintenace contract if you do not have high miles. If not maintenance, some dealers seem to give one as a goodwill gesture, but after that, you are on your own.

There seem to be a few choices on aftermarket. The best know is the UUC uber clutch. You MAY need to raise idle speed depending on how much rollover nosie you have and how much it bothers you.

bbloch apparently has a SPEC setup for high horsepower, low clutch pedal effort and no noticable rollover noise.

Finally, RRobers did a mod to the flywheel to accept an E46 disc. He has an S2 IIRC and he used it at the track with no problems.
Regards,
Jerry
 

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The stock clutch is (as stated above) covered under maintenance. Good luck trying to get it covered otherwise. I was unsuccessful.
The clutch itself only costs ~$400 or less. Labor should be about $600-800 at an independant shop. Add another several hundred dollars for the dealership.
Search and you will find much about the two other options: SPEC and UUC.
 

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boostmiser said:
The stock clutch is (as stated above) covered under maintenance. Good luck trying to get it covered otherwise. I was unsuccessful.
The clutch itself only costs ~$400 or less. Labor should be about $600-800 at an independant shop. Add another several hundred dollars for the dealership.
Search and you will find much about the two other options: SPEC and UUC.
This is good news, but just to make sure that I have it completely right. 2002 M5's have a normal maintenace plan of 3/36k while their bumper to bumper warranty is 4/50k right? B2B warranty does not cover it, but the maintenance agreement does? So technically the car can be under full factory warranty, but still outside of the maintenance plan?

The vehicle I am purchasing looks to have an extended maintenance plan to 4/50k that was purchased by the previous owner, so I should be safe for awhile? Sorry to be so dick and jane, but just want to make completely sure that I am not misunderstanding.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Where in the owners book does it state the clutch is covered under warrenty?

Not sure I want an oversized unit such as the 850csi clutch. ANd like I said NO NOISE, put the clutch in thats it. I'd like to stay stock, but if the dealer is gonna want the same as an aftermarket one or close I'd go aftermarket.

My car is still under the 4/50 1 owner (me) plan. I'm just not sure how bad it would have to be to have them replace it if indeed they even will. Either way the dealer will put it in. Stock or aftermarket, thats why I wanted hours not dollers.
 

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Jayson said:
Has there been a final determination as to what after market clutch kit stands up to the stock power (and maybe headers down the road) with stock feel and NO NOISE! All i want to do is when it's really gone swap it out, not chip to raise the idle either, just the clutch.
Yes Jayson,

This has been determined. NONE.

There is No clutch on the market for the E39 M5, that can handle Stock Power plus headers and give you Stock feel with no noise.

NONE. In this case you cannot have your cake and eat it too. You are only kidding yourself if you believe it can be done. To get stock feel and No noise, it is a compromise, that will eventually fail with hard shifts.

:M5launch: To believe otherwise is Naieve.

If it were truely possible there would not be 400 Clutch threads for you to read.
 

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Jayson said:
My car is still under the 4/50 1 owner (me) plan. I'm just not sure how bad it would have to be to have them replace it if indeed they even will. Either way the dealer will put it in. Stock or aftermarket, thats why I wanted hours not dollers.
Which 4/50 are you referring to? The factory warranty or did you get an extended maintenance plan to increase it from 3/36 to 4/50?
 

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MIB said:
Yes Jayson,

This has been determined. NONE.

There is No clutch on the market for the E39 M5, that can handle Stock Power plus headers and give you Stock feel with no noise.

NONE. In this case you cannot have your cake and eat it too. You are only kidding yourself if you believe it can be done. To get stock feel and No noise, it is a compromise, that will eventually fail with hard shifts.
Mark
I tend to agree with you, but I thought bbloch had a SPEC setup that he claimed had no rollover noise, and stock pedal feel. And RRoberts has a modified stock setup that also seems to work (although I think he swapped out master cylinders to compensate for the stiffer clutch).
Regards,
Jerry
 

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Jayson is looking for good longevity under severe duty street use. IMO, there aren't enough datapoints available to accurately predict the lifecycle of tweaked, little 9-5/8" setups. It's hardly compelling that a "couple" M5 owners who replaced clutches within the last 18 mo, saw no troubles yet. These clutches have seen too few miles. The OEM setup might pass that test.
 

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What exactly does a slipping clutch feel like? Is it possible one could miss the early signs??

All the talk of clutches has me a bit paranoid. I feel a little like a doctor in medical school who gets a rash and assumes he has the rare disease that he just studied.
 

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CEC said:
What exactly does a slipping clutch feel like? Is it possible one could miss the early signs??

All the talk of clutches has me a bit paranoid. I feel a little like a doctor in medical school who gets a rash and assumes he has the rare disease that he just studied.
I first noticed mine feeling soft on a quick 2-3 upshift leaving 2nd at 7k (i.e. typical WOT run through the gears). I haven't done anything about it yet. It still feels fine on a hard 1-2 shift, will hook right up and spin the tires in 2nd, etc. However, it feels soft on the 2-3 shift...

Chuck
 

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I have a 2001 with 13k miles on it. Clutch seems to be fine. Not many miles I know but my queston is this?

I hear talk of clutches slipping and I find that with hard driving (sorta read abuse) so goes the clutch woes. Mods = expect your clutch to fail prematurely.

Also I read alot into peoples driving styles - drag strips/track time etc and of course the beat it on the street methodology. I am not looking down on any of these practices - far from it.

On the other hand I can not tell you the last time I spun the tires or dropped the clutch at a stop light. I enure the clutch is fully engaged before I lay the hammer down - smooth is fast (at least it is on the track)

I went for a long drive this past weekend and was very "spirited with the car". The DSC kicked in long before any tire burning scenerios kicked in...1'st second and around corners in 3rd it is possible to light them up but why?

The DSC (fun stopper) kicked in and stopped things from getting out of hand. Sure there is the intervention factor on my fun but I realy don't mind why abuse $200 tires and drivetrain components.

If I want to really thrash a car around I will take my 911 to the track. If I dumped the clutch at stoplights and spun the tires in 1'st and 2nd I would be searching for a clutch in that car also.

It takes practice, time and finesse to drive a high horspower car (like the M5) at the limit without damaging the components of the drivetrain. Sure you can get in it and drive fast and beat the hell out of it but is that really fun?

One thing that saves my 911 is the drivetrain is not silky smooth like the M5 it needs to me finessed and "learned" to be driven hard at the limit. Shifts in the 911 take awhile to get to know along with clutch menutia - the 911 is one of the harder cars to drive fast. Most people get in my 911 and they are like wtf? How do you drive this thing? My Civic shifts better...

I guess that is why I always will own one. I learn more how to drive it each day and at the track.

I have owned over 20 vehicles - most with clutches some over 200,000 miles on and original oem clutch (back in the college days). Never had one slip, fail or protest. Maybe the M5 is different (weak from the factory I have heard the tales)

Smooth is fast ~ a lot to be said about the statement...

Again I am not preaching but just wondering if there are other folks out there with high miles and hard driven M5's (not read abuse) with oem clutches still intact. If there are then there must be an explanation? Or am I missing something?

-Jeff
 

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Discussion Starter #14
MIB said:
Yes Jayson,

This has been determined. NONE.

There is No clutch on the market for the E39 M5, that can handle Stock Power plus headers and give you Stock feel with no noise.

NONE. In this case you cannot have your cake and eat it too. You are only kidding yourself if you believe it can be done. To get stock feel and No noise, it is a compromise, that will eventually fail with hard shifts.

:M5launch: To believe otherwise is Naieve.

If it were truely possible there would not be 400 Clutch threads for you to read.
Not fooling my self at all, to my knowledge there was none, I just wanted to check and be sure. I'm stuned though sombody hasn't taken the factory clutch and put a carbon ceramic disk to it, that would seem the simplest root to me. Course you need to reface the flywheel too I know.

For the now the car is at stock power, but perhaps down the road I may add headers, not sure yet, if I would go aftermarket just want to be prepared of course instead of doing it twice.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
jlindy said:
Which 4/50 are you referring to? The factory warranty or did you get an extended maintenance plan to increase it from 3/36 to 4/50?
Thats the facotry warrenty for the model year 03, not extended, I have owned my 03 since the begining.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Lscman said:
Jayson is looking for good longevity under severe duty street use. IMO, there aren't enough datapoints available to accurately predict the lifecycle of tweaked, little 9-5/8" setups. It's hardly compelling that a "couple" M5 owners who replaced clutches within the last 18 mo, saw no troubles yet. These clutches have seen too few miles. The OEM setup might pass that test.
Well said, and I havn' tfound the stock clutch to be too bad. It's lasted 31,000 miles, seen the drag strip, some spirited racing, and me learning what it likes for the first 5,000 miles so i dont' find that to be all that bad, not great but not horrible.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
CEC said:
What exactly does a slipping clutch feel like? Is it possible one could miss the early signs??

All the talk of clutches has me a bit paranoid. I feel a little like a doctor in medical school who gets a rash and assumes he has the rare disease that he just studied.
Say you hit the throttle in 1st and bang 2nd gear, you would normally hear a chrip or alot of wheel sping rite? Well with mine on the way out, when i hit 2nd and start to reapplly throttle, nothing...it takes a bit to grab.
 

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Jayson said:
Thats the facotry warrenty for the model year 03, not extended, I have owned my 03 since the begining.
Thanks for the clarification. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but it is my understanding that the factory warranty is completely different from the maintenance warranty. Maintence lasts 3/36 which factory lasts 4/50. With an 03, you should still be under the maintenance warranty which apparently covers the clutch according to other members of this board. Is this not true?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
jlindy said:
Thanks for the clarification. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but it is my understanding that the factory warranty is completely different from the maintenance warranty. Maintence lasts 3/36 which factory lasts 4/50. With an 03, you should still be under the maintenance warranty which apparently covers the clutch according to other members of this board. Is this not true?
My understanding has always been the factory warrenty covers everything but normal wear items such as tires...I'm not sure if the clutch is or not thats my wonderment...I thought up to 02 it was 3 yr 36k miles and for 03 it was 4-50...but 02 may be that way too, all i know is on the sticker it says 4-50k.
 

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Jayson said:
My understanding has always been the factory warrenty covers everything but normal wear items such as tires...I'm not sure if the clutch is or not thats my wonderment...I thought up to 02 it was 3 yr 36k miles and for 03 it was 4-50...but 02 may be that way too, all i know is on the sticker it says 4-50k.
You're probably right. I think the maintenance was extended for 4/50 in 03. It covers oil changes and stuff like that. I was just making sure you were talking about the maintenance and not the factory warranty.
 
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