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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
LOL yeah ... they just updated their site and when you go to the homepage www.vfengineering.com there is a popup disclaimer that they are updating the information on all the pages ....

the price for the kit for 540 is 6K .... I am quite curious about what their setup has to really offer ... can not wait till they post the numbers for M5 ...
I know how much work went into BlackM5 ano others to get them supercharged ...
:wroom:
 

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VF is a highly regarded company in the VW scene. Their supercharger kit for the R32 is very nice. However, I wouldn't put their stuff on a BMW.
 

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Stock horsepower is 230 huh :)


I dont' trust them just cuz their page is messed up :)
 

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I just checked and it's updated, .....?10k
How many have they done? Who's the giunea pig, or who was?
 

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I wonder... I had the VF kit on my daily commuter miata. Built quality and fit and finish were good. GIAC did the software for that setup... I put over 15K miles a year on that setup and it ran flawlessly.. of course, SC'ing the M5 is going to be slightly more complicated...


Keith97M3turbo said:
I just checked and it's updated, .....?10k
How many have they done? Who's the giunea pig, or who was?
 

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They do have a good reputation in the VW/Audi community. I also know GIAC (Garret Lim) writes quality programs. I ran his chip in my 1.8t Jetta for a long time without incident. He does custom programs for the S4, RS6 and others. Relatively speaking in each community, I put Neuspeed on par with Dinan (conservative) and GIAC on par with Powerchip (more aggressive but smooth and reliable). So with his support, I would trust this kit a bit more that without.
I wouldn't write them off just yet. Everyone has to start off somewhere. I would also think that if they were serious about he BMW community, they would be sponsoring this and other forums. They need to have a presence and support what they are selling. Just my $0.02
 

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They claim 600hp base of 400, and 6 psi do the math 200 gained 33 hp per psi of boost off a V2...Having had and used the V2 and seeing so many kits thats an assload gained off just boost and very tuff to belive.
 

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10k for 200hp somebody is sure to try it. i bet they havent even built one yet though.
i heard the 540i they did is dooing really well, no hicups etc.
time will tell

ray
 

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I have the VF supercharger on my 02 Porsche C4S and GIAC did the software. It has bigger injectors and water to air intercooler. Dyno stock was 258 hp at wheels and 411 after SC. I had a poor install by a newbie shop and subsequent problems but now running perfectly with 8000 m. The entire kit is engineered by Evo in Az. Cost was 11k. installed. Will
 

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Jayson said:
They claim 600hp base of 400, and 6 psi do the math 200 gained 33 hp per psi of boost off a V2...Having had and used the V2 and seeing so many kits thats an assload gained off just boost and very tuff to belive.
Not sure why you think that the gain is so out of proportion. FI usually sees gains from 33 to 50%. For example, MB takes the 5.4L from about 360 hp to a supercharged 493, a close to 40% gain. As a production car, I am sure they have plenty of safety margin built in. Little Mini Coopers go from 110 to 170 and that is before anyway uses the 15% reduction pulley for another 25 or so ponies.



Both D/A and Dinan offer similar low boost kits with about the same level of horsepower. Same for CA Automotive, a board sponsor (although no kits shipped yet, they are still testing). This is all without opening the motor AFAIK. Personally, with the high CR, I would not do it without an intercooler/aftercooler setup, but I don' those numbers are out of line even on a low boost (7-8 psi) application.

Personally, I would prefer the simplicity and lack of parasitic losses of a turbo, but packaging makes if very difficult in the M5.

Whether the kit is well engineered is another story, but I think a bunch of folks will be watching as the companies gain information and perfect these kits.
Regards,
Jerry
 

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gsfent said:
Not sure why you think that the gain is so out of proportion. FI usually sees gains from 33 to 50%. For example, MB takes the 5.4L from about 360 hp to a supercharged 493, a close to 40% gain. As a production car, I am sure they have plenty of safety margin built in. Little Mini Coopers go from 110 to 170 and that is before anyway uses the 15% reduction pulley for another 25 or so ponies.



Both D/A and Dinan offer similar low boost kits with about the same level of horsepower. Same for CA Automotive, a board sponsor (although no kits shipped yet, they are still testing). This is all without opening the motor AFAIK. Personally, with the high CR, I would not do it without an intercooler/aftercooler setup, but I don' those numbers are out of line even on a low boost (7-8 psi) application.

Personally, I would prefer the simplicity and lack of parasitic losses of a turbo, but packaging makes if very difficult in the M5.

Whether the kit is well engineered is another story, but I think a bunch of folks will be watching as the companies gain information and perfect these kits.
Regards,
Jerry

On the usal one pound of boost give around 15-20 horsepower. Going with 20, thats 120 gained...Dinan offers other stuff as part of their "kit" ie headers and so on meaning the whole s2 kit. Discovery to as I remember ran way more than 6 psi of boost and also did some other things on all the supercharged cars.

To prove me wrong all you have to do is have them produce somthing real.
 

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Jayson said:
On the usal one pound of boost give around 15-20 horsepower. Going with 20, thats 120 gained...Dinan offers other stuff as part of their "kit" ie headers and so on meaning the whole s2 kit. Discovery to as I remember ran way more than 6 psi of boost and also did some other things on all the supercharged cars.

To prove me wrong all you have to do is have them produce somthing real.
Jayson
I am not trying to "prove" anything. I don't think on its face the claims are that far off. Of course, until we see some actual kits on real cars, we won't know for sure.

As to Dinan, you are right, they add TB's, headers and SOME other necessary stuff from the S2 kit. As for D/A, I will let them share as much or as little as they care too; I know they are interested in the total package and don't usually make any specific horsepower claims. On the Mega horsepower cars, they rebuilt the engine from scratch to race engine standards and lower CR ( around 9:1) IIRC. PhillyM5 and Abdullah prob have something like 800 at the wheels, but again, no one knows until they are dyno'ed.

So, I am not making any judgments until we see what comes actually comes out and what dyno sheets they have to back it up before I say it can't be done. :cheers:
 

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Jayson said:
On the usal one pound of boost give around 15-20 horsepower. Going with 20, thats 120 gained...Dinan offers other stuff as part of their "kit" ie headers and so on meaning the whole s2 kit. Discovery to as I remember ran way more than 6 psi of boost and also did some other things on all the supercharged cars.

To prove me wrong all you have to do is have them produce somthing real.
Actually, there is no "usual" with FI applications at all, nowhere. Boost pressure benefitting an engine depends strongly on the stock CFM and displacement that the engine can produce. Likewise in the world of turbo's, not only your power, but your response, curves, driveability, etc... can be greatly impacted by the selection of the right trim packages. Case in point...if you throw a set of k03's on a mustang GT or camaro or whatever else "american muscle", and you run 10 psi, you may be looking at another 100 or so hp made...now you take those out and put in a set of garrett gt40's in there, and 10 psi is going to start snapping driveshafts and wrinkling pavement. Likewise if you place either the k03 OR a Garrett...whatever trim application, on 1990 civic, and run 10 lbs, you MAY be looking at an extra 50-60 hp, which is a far cry less than what a high displacemtn engine will see. All applications are wildly different and need to be mated correctly. In the case of the S/C applications, take for example a very well known kit from AA for the e46 M3. The base kit has a mere 5.5 lb pulley and it produces an extra 107 chp (or 19.455 hp/lb) on a 3.2L engine. If you place even the same setup on a larger discplacement S62 V8 engine, your results are going to be far from the same, seeing as there are already several kits out now (Dinan, CA auto,) and VF and AA are both announcing 6 lbs of boost in their applications and everyone who has a "bolt on" kit is in the 600 chp range, I'm thinking if these and other independant shops around the world (can't remember the place in AUS that had a pretty stout kit) have put in many many hours of R&D work, money and expertise into it and those are the numbers they are getting, they are probably the ones who have the dyno plots to back up their claims as well. I'm actually very curious to see the final product from everyone out there...especially if they (unlike Dinan) are both providing at least a 2 year warranty on their product, I think THAT speaks volumes about them being confident in their products.

:cheers:

Sean
 

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and to add to this also, 1 psi on boost on rotrex is different from 1psi of lysolm... Not all superchargers are created equal... similarly, with turbo applications, 1psi on a stock K03 is going to produce a lot less CFM that an upgraded/larger K04 on the audi 1.8T's. In this case, the trim wheels, the compressor housing, and the A/R all affect the amount of air being compressed.



SeanMD said:
Actually, there is no "usual" with FI applications at all, nowhere. Boost pressure benefitting an engine depends strongly on the stock CFM and displacement that the engine can produce. Likewise in the world of turbo's, not only your power, but your response, curves, driveability, etc... can be greatly impacted by the selection of the right trim packages. Case in point...if you throw a set of k03's on a mustang GT or camaro or whatever else "american muscle", and you run 10 psi, you may be looking at another 100 or so hp made...now you take those out and put in a set of garrett gt40's in there, and 10 psi is going to start snapping driveshafts and wrinkling pavement. Likewise if you place either the k03 OR a Garrett...whatever trim application, on 1990 civic, and run 10 lbs, you MAY be looking at an extra 50-60 hp, which is a far cry less than what a high displacemtn engine will see. All applications are wildly different and need to be mated correctly. In the case of the S/C applications, take for example a very well known kit from AA for the e46 M3. The base kit has a mere 5.5 lb pulley and it produces an extra 107 chp (or 19.455 hp/lb) on a 3.2L engine. If you place even the same setup on a larger discplacement S62 V8 engine, your results are going to be far from the same, seeing as there are already several kits out now (Dinan, CA auto,) and VF and AA are both announcing 6 lbs of boost in their applications and everyone who has a "bolt on" kit is in the 600 chp range, I'm thinking if these and other independant shops around the world (can't remember the place in AUS that had a pretty stout kit) have put in many many hours of R&D work, money and expertise into it and those are the numbers they are getting, they are probably the ones who have the dyno plots to back up their claims as well. I'm actually very curious to see the final product from everyone out there...especially if they (unlike Dinan) are both providing at least a 2 year warranty on their product, I think THAT speaks volumes about them being confident in their products.

:cheers:

Sean
 

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SANguru said:
and to add to this also, 1 psi on boost on rotrex is different from 1psi of lysolm... Not all superchargers are created equal... similarly, with turbo applications, 1psi on a stock K03 is going to produce a lot less CFM that an upgraded/larger K04 on the audi 1.8T's. In this case, the trim wheels, the compressor housing, and the A/R all affect the amount of air being compressed.
ANd yet we are talking about different boost levels between the companys providing a s/c kit for the same engine with the same supercharger. Vortech V2 provided for the same engine no mattter whos making the kit.


Now if sombody would want to build a kit with a twin screw supercharger I would watch that with so much attention simply cuz max boost kicks in almost right away instead of building up like the V2.
 

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Did this get anywhere? are there any mules running around with this setup?
 

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aaronmiles said:
Did this get anywhere? are there any mules running around with this setup?
Not aware of anyone posting yet, but you might check with Beastpower. He sells VF and has distribution in the U.S. and the U.K.
Regards,
Jerry
 

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AFAIK the S62 kit is still in development.

As a side note a good friend of mine is running the VF kit on his 2000 328i and has had good results.
 
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