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Hey guys, this is apeiron checking in from Germany. Been a long time reader here, since the early M6 days, when my dad had bought one. I have registered some days ago and read up a lot to bring myself up to speed with recent M6 news before asking questions. So here goes.
I am interested in joining the mighty V10 club.

This will come in the form of a beautiful 07 black M6 at a local dealer I have set my sights on. 93.000km and 1 year guarantee for 33000EUR. This is a little bit more expensive than other cars out there from the same year and around the same mileage but, it is coming with a 1 year guarantee on all things engine and clutch related so I guess it is worth it since I have read that the guarantee is a must.

My question is, what should I check when I go to the dealer tomorrow? What would you guys check given your experience with the car. I am aware of the VANOS and rod bearing issues, but other than checking for black mucky oil around the VANOS tubes or how frequently the previous owner changed his oil, there is not much to go around with. Needless to say that new rod bearings will be my first investment pretty much straight out of the dealer. Anything else you guys can suggest to make sure this will be a good buy and I will not be left in tears?


Thank you very much in advance, and I hope I will be seeing you guys around very much, very soon. :)

PS: If there are any other friends out there from Germany that would would like to get to know each other and maybe help, shoot me a pm with your email since I am new and cannot use the PM system myself just yet.
 

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Did the dealer do a pre-purchase inspection? If so, ask to see the report. Ask for the maintenance history. Other than that, there's not too much you can do while the car is on the dealer's lot. If you've never driven one before, you won't really know what the car sounds like and the SMG shifts like, so you're going on a lot of faith that the dealer is not trying to sell you someone else's problems. Good luck.
 

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Where in Germany are you based ? I'm contemplating selling my 06 vert I've just had a brand new engine fitted curtacy of bmw as they managed to drop my original engine while changing the rod bearings, I've also just had a new oil cooler 200km ago and a new clutch less than 8000km ago. Full bmw service with all bills and recipts for over 20k in extras. It's one of only 31 ever made, so very rare. More details are covered in my signature.

I'm based in Berlin, oh yeah car has covered 89000km from new and 2000k on new engine. I'm sure through the search function on the site you can find many pictures of mine to view.
 

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So, I went by and saw it today. I really liked it.

Previous owner was, supposedly, since I have no way of proving this, a lady, very high ranked in a very big firm. Her husband drives a Merc G class jeep, son an M4, and she sold the M6 to get the new 650 cabrio. The lady was a local, so all the services were done at this dealer, so they seemed to have a very good idea about the car.
The car looked very well taken caren of, the only thing I noticed was the stiching on the steering wheel had started to come off, but nothing major. She took such good care of the car, than even the door sils were changed with brand new ones. This really impressed me.

I looked at the service history, the only thing that concerned me was the 2nd oil change was doen 20.000 KM after the first one (that one was at 2.400). Not sure how this could have affected the whole rod bearing story. The technicians there seemed pretty adamant that the car has no problem and they have never heard of rod bearings issues with the M6, only with M3, and this was according to them, and I quote, "because the owners were idiots".

Among other things, the car has a new flywheel, tires, front brake pads and some other shizzle. Also the dealer chopped a couple of thousand off of the price which is always welcome. The car has a BMW 1-year warranty for everything apart from the expendables. This is extendable to 1 more year for 1000 EUR.

This is pretty much all I have right now, I realise it is not much to go by with, but what is your expert opinion? Yay or nay?
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Where in Germany are you based ? I'm contemplating selling my 06 vert I've just had a brand new engine fitted curtacy of bmw as they managed to drop my original engine while changing the rod bearings, I've also just had a new oil cooler 200km ago and a new clutch less than 8000km ago. Full bmw service with all bills and recipts for over 20k in extras. It's one of only 31 ever made, so very rare. More details are covered in my signature.

I'm based in Berlin, oh yeah car has covered 89000km from new and 2000k on new engine. I'm sure through the search function on the site you can find many pictures of mine to view.
Hello there, yes, I have seen your car and it looks great. The best interion/exterior combo if you ask me. I had a similar one on my Z4. I would be interested yeah, but I am in the south. So lets see how this goes with the one I have currently my eyes on and I will let you know.
It is nice to have a local on these forums, for discussion, advice etc etc, so I would really like to stay in touch whatever happens.
 

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So, I went by and saw it today. I really liked it.

Previous owner was, supposedly, since I have no way of proving this, a lady, very high ranked in a very big firm. Her husband drives a Merc G class jeep, son an M4, and she sold the M6 to get the new 650 cabrio. The lady was a local, so all the services were done at this dealer, so they seemed to have a very good idea about the car.
The car looked very well taken caren of, the only thing I noticed was the stiching on the steering wheel had started to come off, but nothing major. She took such good care of the car, than even the door sils were changed with brand new ones. This really impressed me.

I looked at the service history, the only thing that concerned me was the 2nd oil change was doen 20.000 KM after the first one (that one was at 2.400). Not sure how this could have affected the whole rod bearing story. The technicians there seemed pretty adamant that the car has no problem and they have never heard of rod bearings issues with the M6, only with M3, and this was according to them, and I quote, "because the owners were idiots".

Among other things, the car has a new flywheel, tires, front brake pads and some other shizzle. Also the dealer chopped a couple of thousand off of the price which is always welcome. The car has a BMW 1-year warranty for everything apart from the expendables. This is extendable to 1 more year for 1000 EUR.

This is pretty much all I have right now, I realise it is not much to go by with, but what is your expert opinion? Yay or nay?
Wow, car buying in Germany sounds the same as in the US. The sales guy telling you a little old lady from Pasadena babied the car and the technicians telling you there are no issues to be concerned with.

By the way, the M3 S65 engine is derived from the S85 in the M6. Ask the technicians about the fact that the rod bearings are the same!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_S65
 

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Just the fact that the techs AT THE DEALERSHIP are saying "don't worry about rod bearings" ......says that they really don't know what they're doing or the car might be vulnerable to potential rod bearing damage soon, so they're trying to get it out of their inventory ASAP.

Be careful when you pull the trigger. It's not worth pulling the trigger so hastily.
 

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The car looked very well taken caren of, the only thing I noticed was the stiching on the steering wheel had started to come off, but nothing major. She took such good care of the car, than even the door sils were changed with brand new ones.

I looked at the service history, the only thing that concerned me was the 2nd oil change was doen 20.000 KM after the first one (that one was at 2.400). , The technicians there seemed pretty adamant that the car has no problem and they have never heard of rod bearings issues with the M6

Among other things, the car has a new flywheel, tires, front brake pads and some other shizzle. Also the dealer chopped a couple of thousand off of the price which is always welcome. The car has a BMW 1-year warranty for everything apart from the expendables. This is extendable to 1 more year for 1000 EUR.
After reading your post there were several things that stick out. I highlighted them in red. The car may be great, but I don't trust that you are getting a real story from the dealer.

They can't have any way to know about the Rod bearings. Never heard on an M6 issue? Really?

Stitching issue on the wheel is weird.

New Sills? Why? To replace the lights?

If it's a BMW warranty, and you can get 2 years and go to any dealer it's a good idea. I would get the car checked out but someone else first. If it checks out and you are happy with the price, then go for it.
 

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Thank you all for your replies.

I am not 100% sure if the BMW warranty covers a new engine, I think it does, and it should, but best to check it.

The red/blue stiching had started to come off, not sure why, other than that, the steering wheel looked in good shape, no friction damage as one would expect from a heavy drifter :biggrinbounce: What had friction damage and I found weird, was the start/stop button. The lettering was starting to come off, made me wonder how easy this thing peels off or how many times that button has been pushed.

The sils where changed because of the lights, yes. This, to me, is an indication of a good owner. The flywheel was changed because it was "its time" according to the techies.

I am not sure how much I should buy into this story, it is almost too good to be true. I am just thinking that if I were a dealer, I wouldn't buy just any crap car and then have a white elephant in my lot that I could not sell due to its crappiness. These guys, bought the M6 of a good customer, a car that they know, because all the services were done there, so it must be in a decent shape.

About the techies not knowing or even heard of the rod bearing issue in any other other cars that they service is extremely odd to me. I wouldn't think that they are lying just to sell the car, I told them my dad had the same car, I showed knowledge about the car and its issues, surely I would be the last person that they would try to lie to. Again, this is entirely my reasoning and the truth can be very far off.

Anyway, if the trigger gets pulled, I would have check the bearings, surely after 93.000km, one of them is bound to be beat. Then it is warranty claim time.

Any thoughts?
 

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My 2 Euros worth as I’ve gone through most of below in Germany with BMW in the last 2 months<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" /><o:p></o:p>
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Thank you all for your replies.

I am not 100% sure if the BMW warranty covers a new engine, I think it does, and it should, but best to check it.<o:p></o:p>

No it will not, especially if the engine failure is due to “general wear” as they call it

The red/blue stiching had started to come off, not sure why, other than that, the steering wheel looked in good shape, no friction damage as one would expect from a heavy drifter
<?xml:namespace prefix = v ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" /><v:shapetype id=_x0000_t75 stroked="f" filled="f" path="[email protected]@[email protected]@[email protected]@[email protected]@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600"><v:stroke joinstyle="miter"></v:stroke><v:formulas><v:f eqn="if lineDrawn pixelLineWidth 0"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum @0 1 0"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum 0 0 @1"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @2 1 2"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @3 21600 pixelWidth"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @3 21600 pixelHeight"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum @0 0 1"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @6 1 2"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @7 21600 pixelWidth"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum @8 21600 0"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @7 21600 pixelHeight"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum @10 21600 0"></v:f></v:formulas><v:path o:connecttype="rect" gradientshapeok="t" o:extrusionok="f"></v:path><o:lock aspectratio="t" v:ext="edit"></o:lock></v:shapetype><v:shape style="WIDTH: 14.25pt; HEIGHT: 18pt; VISIBILITY: visible; mso-wrap-style: square" id=Picture_x0020_1 type="#_x0000_t75" alt="http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/images/smilies/biggrinbounce.gif" o:spid="_x0000_i1025"><v:imagedata o:title="biggrinbounce" src="file:///C:\Users\u8000298\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01\clip_image001.gif"></v:imagedata></v:shape>What had friction damage and I found weird, was the start/stop button. The lettering was starting to come off, made me wonder how easy this thing peels off or how many times that button has been pushed.<o:p></o:p>
Under “general use” this should not wear, however if the button has become dirty, they maybe being over enthusiastic in cleaning it back to white letters has caused it to peel?

The sils where changed because of the lights, yes. This, to me, is an indication of a good owner. The flywheel was changed because it was "its time" according to the techies.<o:p></o:p>

My flywheel was changed as a precaution when I had a new clutch fitted as advised by myself – BMW never advised me there was a “its time period” unless you are changing the timing belt which then is around 120,000km

I am not sure how much I should buy into this story, it is almost too good to be true. I am just thinking that if I were a dealer, I wouldn't buy just any crap car and then have a white elephant in my lot that I could not sell due to its crappiness. These guys, bought the M6 of a good customer, a car that they know, because all the services were done there, so it must be in a decent shape.<o:p></o:p>

Not really, they could take the car knowing the previous owner is a “good customer” and will always come back, especially if bought another new BMW, their now used / sold M6 could then be passed on / sold to “anybody” in the country or out, so the dealer is only really interested in “cash money in the bank for the sale – anything afterwards becomes a bonus”

About the techies not knowing or even heard of the rod bearing issue in any other other cars that they service is extremely odd to me. I wouldn't think that they are lying just to sell the car, I told them my dad had the same car, I showed knowledge about the car and its issues, surely I would be the last person that they would try to lie to. Again, this is entirely my reasoning and the truth can be very far off.<o:p></o:p>

Maybe they are telling the truth – “that this specific dealer has not changed any rod bearings” – they are not saying “they have never heard of any BMW M6 having rod bearings changed

Anyway, if the trigger gets pulled, I would have check the bearings, surely after 93.000km, one of them is bound to be beat. Then it is warranty claim time.<o:p></o:p>

If you are having the bearings checked BMW will do / charge the following. First Pull the engine, then strip it down on the bench. If only having the bearings and bolts changed, this will be around 3.5k euros, they will also run a check on the crank shaft tolerances, and although my bearing appeared ok from the pictures, they crank was out of tolerance which would have been an additional 3k incl part & labour. As I mentioned earlier during the bench strip down, BWM somehow dropped mine, so I never had to pay for the bearings or crank and I got a new complete engine inc vanos pump etc… which is now fully covered by BMW’s usual 12 to 12 months parts warrantee

Any thoughts?<o:p></o:p>

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http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e63-bmw-m6-forum-bmw-m6-convertible-m6board-com/388233-rod-bearing-thread-help-others.html<o:p></o:p>
 

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Thank you very much for your time and reply Muscles.

I now have concrete data about the oil changes and their frequency on the car, I was hoping someone good give me their opinion on it.

1st @ 2631km ~ 1634mi
2nd @ 25.338km ~ 15.744mi
3rd @ 48.916km ~ 30.394mi
4th @ 73.799km ~ 45.856mi
5th @ 89.551km ~ 55.644mi

current mileage: 93.000km ~ 57.787mi

So that is 5 changes in almost 56.000 miles. 1 every 11.000 miles on average. Not great, but, imho, not terrible either. All withing "BMWs acceptable/recommended range" but not close to what I or you guys know is good for the car or would have done.

I can also see new spark plugs, forward and rear brake pads.

As I said, the car will come with BMWs guarantee, so I am not terribly worried, but still, I would like to have your opinion. Apologies if I am sounding like a nitpicker, I am sure you understand :)
 
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