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Discussion Starter #1
Friends came by yesterday and took them on a drive..
I was showing off a little, goosing the throttle a bit.. :M5launch:

Anyways.. I eventually came to a stop and decided.. Hmmm
Let me try to warm up the tires a little.. So... I turned Sport on, and
DSC off.. I tach it up to about 6-7K dropped the hammer. and
vrooooom but no go... How embarassing..:eek:
So I tried it again..... Nooo goo....:(

Driven normal, seems just fine.. But with immitation of michael Schumcker..(sp)
the Beast isn't up to snuff...

Anyways.. AFTER researching local dealerships in the Washington DC area.
I come to the conclusion that Towson BMW in MD is the best local one around. DOES THIS STILL HOLD TRUE???? because its like a 2 hour drive
and I would like NOT to go that far and waste my time to get. FORKED... :eek:h:

I do not think Inspection II was done on the car yet.. its at 75K miles .
So im ready to do:
Inspection II (CPO)
New Rotors/breaks..(pads look low, and rotors could be changed, thanks cpo)
New Clutch and any relevant componet i guesss.. (This will be the 2nd Clutch,
do you think the Fly wheel need to be changed?, again CPO)
Bushings/Shocks ( Hear clunking going over Speedbumps)
Belts/Hoses (CPO)
Airfiltters, Intake, Cabin (CPO??)
Oil, coolant, tranny, diff FLUIDS (CPO?)
SPark Plugs / Wires (CPO?)

Anything I am Missing??????

Oh yea.. is Transmission whine normal, on these cars??
I assume it is.. but you never know.. When radio is off
and driving.. you hear a transmission whine a little..

THanks for any imputs/advice :thumbsup:

T
 

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I can remark in a few areas:

First, the M5 has so much torque, a 2000 RPM launch should melt the tires. No need for higher RPMs. It's likely that even with DSC off, a 6000 RPM launch is detected by the computer and it puts an end to the fun. You have to pull fuses to dyno the car all the way to 7000 RPM because it compares engine speed to road speed and doesn't allow high RPMs while standing still. A 6000 RPM launch is also a good way to destroy the relatively weak clutch.

Second, an Inspection II replaces several things mentioned:
Air filters, fuel filter, cabin filters, oil, coolant, spark plugs, and a few more items. It can cost $1000! Belts and hoses would be extra.

Apparently dirty MAF sensors can dramatically cut power. I don't think I have that problem yet at 60k miles but I haven't had a chance to do the fuel flow test to know for sure.

I have a little transmission whine. I have heard worse than my car is. Dealers say it's normal.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thanks Richard, for your response.

Thats quite interesting.. I didn't know that
the OBC dictated the way you drive when DSC is off
and Sport is on.. Hmmmm Interesting.. Pull fuse??
WHICH ONE?? never the less the clutch does need
to be replaced.. I can feel vibration and twitches thru
the clutch pedal.. Do you Think the FLY wheel should
be replaced with 2nd clutch???? MIght as well right?? (CPO) haha.
Oh Yea.. After my impersonation of John Force in the NHRA nationals.
after it was parked.. We could deffinately smell the CLUTCH.
So if the OBC Shuts the car down, on High RPM take offs..
Wonder why its still burning the clutch.. Hmmmm.

OH yea.. isn't BELTS in the CPO maintence plan. it is
after a wear able item..

Any other suggestions ???? on service to be done??

and TOWSON BMW.. THumbs up or down????

thanks

:noSMG:
Richard in NC said:
I can remark in a few areas:

First, the M5 has so much torque, a 2000 RPM launch should melt the tires. No need for higher RPMs. It's likely that even with DSC off, a 6000 RPM launch is detected by the computer and it puts an end to the fun. You have to pull fuses to dyno the car all the way to 7000 RPM because it compares engine speed to road speed and doesn't allow high RPMs while standing still. A 6000 RPM launch is also a good way to destroy the relatively weak clutch.

Second, an Inspection II replaces several things mentioned:
Air filters, fuel filter, cabin filters, oil, coolant, spark plugs, and a few more items. It can cost $1000! Belts and hoses would be extra.

Apparently dirty MAF sensors can dramatically cut power. I don't think I have that problem yet at 60k miles but I haven't had a chance to do the fuel flow test to know for sure.

I have a little transmission whine. I have heard worse than my car is. Dealers say it's normal.
 

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E39 Mfive - a few thoughts. I got my M5 last month and have been in Towson
BMW 3 times. My review as well as many others on the forum, EXCELLENT service and knowledge.

aS for your experience, please look up my post (mike_balt and the title was something like (clutch problems, can you diagnose?"). I bought my CPO car from another dealer and had towson replace my clutch at no cost because the selling dealer stood behind their car. Yippee.

A few thoughts pertaining to your post. I agree, to what I understand, the car won't deal with a high RPM clutch drop.

REplace the flyuwheel...as I understand it, the flywheel has spring loaded dampening and costs somewhere in the neighborhood of $1500. Other M5'ers true or not? If so, it would be cold day before CPO bought that.

Also, read the CPO agreement. It doesn't cover much but total failure of items that are not wear related. So study up before confronting dealer.

if you go to Towson, use Terrance Savoy. Great. Richard is not someone I'd use again.

hope that helps
 

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E39_MFIVE,

I think you may have toasted the clutch. Or someone else did it before you got the car. As Richard pointed out, a 2000 RPM launch is quite aggressive with this engine. Anything above 2-3 k RPM is completely pointless abuse.

Try a 2k RPM clutch-drop. If that works, then fine, enjoy the car. If it does not work, then you definitely need a new clutch, and better get it before you damage the fly-wheel surface.

David
 

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I purchased the CPO for my own car for the warrenty coverage of big items. It does not extend the free maintenance of wear items. As mike_balt mentioned, read up on what's covered. If you don't have papers with the car, check the bmwusa.com website. It's in there somewhere.

The CPO process seems to be more an inspection than refreshment of items. Only things obviously bad get the attention. For eample if you bought the car at 45k miles, they probably don't replace things not scheduled until the 60k Inspection II. If >60k miles those things (filters, plugs, etc should be new).

The clutch and brake pads could be argued over if you bought the car used expecting them to be up to snuff. I do hope if you pursue this that the 6k launch didn't destroy the clutch which would look like recent abuse to them. But, a weak clutch is more suseptable to slipping and burning when driven hard, so the "abused clutch" is self-fullfilling the longer you go.

Others will need to chine in on what a really bad clutch feels like. In general a slipping clutch allows revs to climb and doesn't hook up poperly in certain circumstances.
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
Well the car is driving fine.
Drove it all day yesterday and seemed to hold
well with some wot runs from 30mph and up..

The clutch is on its way, out. its losing
grip from the torque from the fire breathing V8,
from a stand still..

We'lll see what the dealership have to say..
wish me luck..
 

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Good luck, sounds like a clutch issue. BTW CPO does not cover replacing clutch. I tried, but good luck anyway keep us posted.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
CPO Maintence does.. Does it not??? :eek:oohhh:

im pretty sure it does....


Beamer_usa said:
Good luck, sounds like a clutch issue. BTW CPO does not cover replacing clutch. I tried, but good luck anyway keep us posted.
 

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E39 MFIVE said:
CPO Maintence does.. Does it not??? :eek:oohhh:

im pretty sure it does....
Never heard of CPO maintenance. There is a 6/100 maintenance plan, but it has to be put in place before the 4/50 expires. There is a CPO inspection befoe a car is resold, but that is it, at least that I am aware of. If the clutch turns out not to be covered, consider some aftermarket options....UUC among them.
Regards,
Jerry
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Ray540. i assume you used towson and sterling
curious why would you rate sterling better than Towson..?

Ok Consensus is Towson BMW and Sterling in Ashburn are
the two better ones in the area..

Decisions decisions.. they are both about same distance apart.


ray540inyc said:
sterling bmw is way better than towson btw.
 

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E39 MFIVE said:
CPO Maintence does.. Does it not??? :eek:oohhh:

im pretty sure it does....
If the mechanic that cracks it open decides he thinks there was ANY ABUSE, by anyone- you or any prior owner- then the " CPO Extended Warranty" will not cover in NOR WILL the "extended maintenance agreement".

Plenty of stories here where folks with both plans got screwed.

having both these plans is not a 'bullet proof shield' that will enable you to get anything refurbished: items must be physically broken for the warranty to apply, and the maintenance must be at or beyond the very minimal BMW specifies. (Oil changes only at a crazy long interval- brakes only when they are below a few mm left...no tranny service, no differential services...)

Good luck with the dealer on the clutch- if you burn the flywheel trying to prove the clutch is bad, you may find yourself with a hefty bill.

A
 

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E39 MFIVE said:
CPO Maintence does.. Does it not??? :eek:oohhh:

im pretty sure it does....
10 times out of 10 will tell you that it is driver abuse and I not covered by CPO extended warranty. If they don't tell you that, they will tell you to read the fine print on the CPO extended warranty. It clearly states that "wear and tear" items are not covered. The clutch, unfortunately, is a wear and tear item.
I went through all this about 8 months ago, it was a hair pulling experience:mad: , to say the least. I hope you have better luck than I did, keep us posted, I'll be interested in hearing what they have to say - Good Luck!
 

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It's one of those "fine print" things in the warranty: "Is the clutch covered?" "Yes"

But it is covered for manufacturing defects, not wearing out.

Then you turn to maintenance coverage: "Is the clutch covered?" "Yes, but this isn't normal wear and tear it is abuse."

Having said this, some folks have gotten it covered- depends on the SA and dealership...
 

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How about non dealers?


ive always heard great things about urbans
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Drum roll please: I took the Beast to......

TOWSON BMW, from all the search, responses, feedback.
I decided to go with Towson and use Terrence Savoy as an SA.
I asked for him specifically..

I called this morning to make sure it was Ok for me to take my car
up and if they had a loaner.. Mr Savoy wasn't available.. So I left a msg.
So after 10 minutes he returned my call, very promptly and told me
everything was OK, to bring the car in and loaner. Sweet..:)

So i take the 2hr drive.. and finally get to the Dealership..
the Dealership/Service dept was very clean and very professional looking
inside and out.. Unlike Sterling, which has the service dept and sales
all lumped in same building.. Which seems chaotic a bit and busy.

Anyways.. I go and talk to the Mr Savoy. He tells me the Beast was
recently put into inspection I, about 10K miles ago.. And that
they wouldn't be able to do Inspection II until at least 15K total miles
after the last inspection.. Bummer.. But its cool.. He said after another
5 thousand more miles.. inspectionII wouldn't be an issue what so ever.

Beamer_USA you were correct about the Clutch and being a wearble item.
and etc.. and that they would look at it and etc etc.. But couldn't
tell me if CPO Maintence would cover it.. Until they look at it.. So we'll
see. So I put it in service for the following:

alignment - $189.00 usd.. Supposedly its a special way BMW align their cars with load..

Dieselly noise when car is warm, from Vanos..We'll see about this one to.

Clunking in the suspension when going over speed bumps and
turning the wheel lock to lock. I told them i suspect the bushings or shocks.
we'll see on this also.

Brakes.. Pads/rotors if needed..

And set my door locks to lock @5mph.. $49..:(

Transmission whine.. Was told if a problem.. They would replace the whole
thing.. They don't fix it. So we'll see on this also

Rear DIff had caked on stuff on it, like it had a leak.. We'll see on this also

SO overall.. I had a very good experience at Towson , clean, professional
and friendly.. Terrance Savory was very friendly.
I also received a 05 325xi with SMG as a free Loaner..mmmmmm

Before I left.. I gave Mr Savoy, some Cash to buy some Lunch.
He seemed very appreciative.. and Just asked him to do
what ever he can do for me.......

SO WISH ME LUCK.. the EPIC continuess... :thumbsup:
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Update:

Got the call from the SA.

Things covered:

Rear Diff fix - cpo
Blower Fan - cpo
Brakes/Rotors f+r -cpo
Guibo - cpo <-was diagnosed was causing the slight whine in the tranny

in mediation:
The Clutch. The SA said they were gonna pull off the clutch and see if the
clutch/flywheel is blue/glazed or not. Showing abuse or not.
If it isn't blue.. Its gonna be covered under cpo. If it is blue..
I swallow $750 to put it back together or $1300 for new clutch.
I got my fingers crossed.. I hope, that this isn't a totally subjective test.
Im gonna ask to see the part, before I opt to put it together with new or upgrade..

Other things they found:
costing me $$..

Thrust Rod bushings.
- first of all what the HELL is it???
- failure prone??
- $350, not sure if its for the set or just one side

Rear Sway bar is loose..
- Is this something I can do myself??
- hope important is it.

Left Rear Ball joint
- is leaking or something.

Vanos, sounding dieselly..
- SA said it was normal
- granted mine is light and some say its normal.. I still had to ask.

Any tips advice opinions(good) are appreciated..
 

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E39 MFIVE said:
Update:

Got the call from the SA.

in mediation:
The Clutch. The SA said they were gonna pull off the clutch and see if the
clutch/flywheel is blue/glazed or not. Showing abuse or not.
If it isn't blue.. Its gonna be covered under cpo. If it is blue..
I swallow $750 to put it back together or $1300 for new clutch.
I got my fingers crossed.. I hope, that this isn't a totally subjective test.
Im gonna ask to see the part, before I opt to put it together with new or upgrade..

Other things they found:
costing me $$..

Thrust Rod bushings.
- first of all what the HELL is it???
- failure prone??
- $350, not sure if its for the set or just one side

Rear Sway bar is loose..
- Is this something I can do myself??
- hope important is it.

Left Rear Ball joint
- is leaking or something.

Vanos, sounding dieselly..
- SA said it was normal
- granted mine is light and some say its normal.. I still had to ask.

Any tips advice opinions(good) are appreciated..
Do a search, especially on comments from Lscman. If I remember correctly, he advised that the blueing was not just from abuse, but from excessive heat. That can be caused by abuse, or by failure of the self adjusting cluthc mechanism (SAC). When it fails to operate properly, the disc does not get proper engagement, causing excess heat and the blueing effect. Make sure they check the SAC and they save all the old parts for you!!

The M5 clutch is a known weak point. We get the same clutch as the 528! It is usually covered at least once by the dealership. Some cover it as wear and tear early on under the maintenance plan, some cover under warranty if the SAC fails, and some cover it under dealership good will (although I have never heard of anyone getting more than one replacement). See if your car ever got a new clutch. And if they tell you it is not a problem we can get dozens of people in this board to attest otherwise!! My dealership (large) even stocks an M5 clutch replacement kit! (disc, pressure plate, flywheel, throw out bearing, etc).

Rear swaybar brackets fail all the time. Go aftermarket, Beastpower (former board member) and TCM (current board member) are two good sources.

Thrust bushings are typical wear items, not a good design IMHO. I believe an upgrade is to use the ones from either X5 or 740. Do a search.

Finally, who did the prepurchase inspection? If CPO, all these things should have been noted. I might go back to the selling dealer and look for some contribution on non covered items.
Regards,
Jerry
 
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