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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Problem just started up today

no problem driving in circles at JFK

then on the way back home moving through traffic i noticed it was harder to weave left than right

by the time i got off the parkway Left turns had become very hard while Right turns where unaffected

i gave the car a few tosses left and right and it was clearly Stiffening on Left turns

weaving around in my driveway it was even harder and increasing engine speed didn't seem to help

i'm thinking it's the steering gear as per this thread:
http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e39-m5-e52-z8-discussion/149219-stiff-steering-very-slow-speed.html
 

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Discussion Starter #4
report:

just checked the car and got back from a quick drive with a weird outcome

#1: visual check
i've got a noticeable leak on the driver's side (exact location coming)
nothing out of place with the linkage
-no weird angles/positions
-no rips
-dry

#2: drive (SPORT - OFF)
-the drive started out with the steering still stiff on left turns (much stiffer than sport obviously)
--stiff u-turns
--stiff left-hand circles
--stiff weaving

on the final u-turn it was still stiff (from here it's a straight shot to my house with a left-hander into the garage)

i did some HARD and fast slalom tosses
- the steering has now completely freed up on Left handers
- it's at the point where there is no feedback
*i was afraid i lost left-hand steering, but i didn't
- i can steer left perfectly
- it's just SUPER easy now


what! the! f*ck!?
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
leak:

i'm thinking the leak is ATF coming from the p/s pump
i don't have oil spots in the garage for it

leak source
this area is not cover by an underbody shield
the item circled is a bolt and the leak would drip from here (if it where severe enough)
the subframe behind this bolt is also wet


in the image you're looking directly up at the US-driver's side front suspension components

BMW TIS - 31 11 001 Replacing front axle support (high)

*use the pitman arm and swaybar to orient your view
 

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There are flow restrictive washers in most systems on power steering systems. Often a washer with a small hole. Sounds like one got plugged then with all your forcing the restictor has popped free so now the oil flow to freely. Other than that can't help no idea where it is in these cars nor do I even know if it is a single or double system. The last one I dealt with was a single and was a pluggy thing about 1/2" long and it was crimped into the middle of the pressure line. I blew out of place and went to the rack. Intermittent problems similar to yours, but only every other time.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Wonderful...

In case anyone is wondering, the unrestricted flow feels deader than any mercedes... like the spline gears all broke off
 

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My PS pump imploded in a very big way.... as a result, my system ran dry with much destruction.

I replaced all hoses, pump and reservoir...and flushed it 4 times.

Then drove it. Left turns had ZERO power steering assist.

I surmised that in the PS gear box there are two circuits, and depending on the direction of the turn, fluid goes into one of two paths- debris was in one of them.

I went a few weeks, then did a last ditch flushing, and it worked. I was actually planning on a reverse flush of just the box but it wasn't needed.

GL

A
 

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I have the same issue here as well except mine is with right hand turns at parking lot speeds. It get's stiff, but loosens up with a blip of the throttle. I had a leak for the longest, but I just topped it off with ATF...figured I'd have a complete flush and hose replacement done when I have some free time. So, I took it to my Indy last week and he said I do not need a flush as the fluid was clean and that the hoses are fine, but the clamp was loose causing the leak so he replaced it with a heavy duty one.

He mentioned to me that he had the same problem with his '00 M5 and replacing the ABS module solved the problem. Although, my ABS light has never come on, he said it eventually will and this is an early symptom...whatevs. He also suggested that my steering box might be on its way out. I am kind of leaning towards the steering box because I have other issues with my steering that I am still yet to rectify. Ever since I did my coilover install my steering has been acting weird. After a right turn at a light, the steering is off-center to left in order to maintain a straight path and vise versa after a left turn. Things sort themselves out after maintaining a straight path for a few miles(steering back to center) then starts again at the new light:mad:.

There is another member here that experienced un-usual stiffness with the steering and replacing the Servotronic, #5 in the diagram here: RealOEM.com   BMW E39 M5 Hydro steering box solved his issue.

Anyways between Tranc and a couple other members on this board, it seems the steering box on our cars start to degrade at higher mileage and isn't quite noticeable until it's swapped.

Vic
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I'm still waiting on some stuff so i can get the front end off the ground

I'm going to check the line as sailor pointed out, flush the system (in case of debris) and run the car without restrictor. After a week if it is indeed just the line ill replace it based on the steering feel

At first i thought it might have been the speed sensor on the wheel, but no dsc light. Then the steering gear because it was only in the one direction, but after it freed up the other night i'm going to troubleshoot it myself

I'm thinking the line is going to be like this one for torque specs?
BMW TIS - 32 13 060 Removing and installing power steering (high)
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
took a crack at it finally

the Hose that might hold the restrictor - #5




Hose #5
is the other hose attached to the p/s pump and goes from the pump to the Steering Gear
- only the ends as shown in the diagram are correct
- the middle section of the hose is different
- there are Large - Reducing points at both ends of the hose



things to know for left hand drive cars:

- the middle section of hose #5 you've all probably seen many times - it's the one with the silver ribbed shielding that runs along BANK 2 bellow the valve cover
- at the ends it reduces from a thick (approx 1" - 1.5" thick hose to the ?brass? 0.5" tube)
- both ends of the hose are the same with Banjo Tips (different size Heads, same bolt Width)
ONLY APPLIES TO
STEERING GEAR
07 Gasket ring A14X20-CUSN 2 32411093596 $0.31
ONLY APPLIES TO VANE PUMP
07 Gasket ring A16X22-CUSN 2 32411093597 $0.27
- the end that is bolted to the Steering Gear has a bracket that attaches Hose #5 to Hose #8
- i don't see a way to remove this bracket so you have to take both hoses off
- the end that is bolted to the steering gear doubles back under itself so you first have to take hose #5 off the p/s pump just to see the end that attaches to the steering gear
- to take of either hose #5 or #8 you'll likely need
---- (x2) 6"+ extensions
---- (x2) swivel joint
---- maybe you can try and get away with a really long extension and a single swivel joint, either way best of luck aligning the washers from up top




attached pictures of my reservoir filter
 

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The only scenario in which I was able to imagine an effect in one direction and not the other, is internal to the steering box. As I recall from looking at a schematic on 'how power steering works', there is a vane that senses steering input (left or right) and directs fluid to either a 'left assist' or 'right assist'. My theory was one of mine was clogged with pump parts....
 

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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
The only scenario in which I was able to imagine an effect in one direction and not the other, is internal to the steering box. As I recall from looking at a schematic on 'how power steering works', there is a vane that senses steering input (left or right) and directs fluid to either a 'left assist' or 'right assist'. My theory was one of mine was clogged with pump parts....
if that's what's going on then i'm ok
-i did a flush + the reservoir
i'll go out for a drive tonight and see how it feels - haven't driven it since last week

but i'd like to change everything out for smaller hoses
the BMW ones are so cumbersome for no reason

No. Description Supplement Qty From Up To Part Number Price Notes Photo
01 SUCTION HOSE 1 32412228873 $37.89 +core
02 Hose clamp D=20,9-24,1 2 32111131345 $2.12
05 PRESSURE HOSE ASSY 1 32412228867 $229.83
ONLY APPLIES TO
STEERING GEAR
06 HOLLOW BOLT M14X1,5X26 1 02/2012 32416783886 $2.11
06 HOLLOW BOLT M14X1,5X26 1 32416852469
ONLY APPLIES TO VANE PUMP
06 HOLLOW BOLT M16X28 1 32411117182 ENDED
ONLY APPLIES TO
STEERING GEAR
07 Gasket ring A14X20-CUSN 2 32411093596 $0.31
ONLY APPLIES TO VANE PUMP
07 Gasket ring A16X22-CUSN 2 32411093597 $0.27
08 Return pipe 1 32411094205 $108.07
09 HOLLOW BOLT M16X28 1 32411117182 ENDED
10 Gasket ring A16X22-CUSN 2 32411093597 $0.27
11 O-ring 10,82X1,78/FPM 2 17211742636 $0.80
12 COOLING COIL 1 17111141819 $107.30
13 Screw M8X28-Z3 1 06/2000 17227555715 $0.78
13 Hex bolt with washer M8X30-Z3 1 07119915085 $0.62
14 Hose clamp D=16,6-20MM 1 16121180242 $1.08
15 Return pipe 1 32412228868 $41.26 +core
16 Hose clamp 1 11722241129 $2.30
17 Expanding nut 1 06/2002 52531451393 $0.75


going off the bolts sizes i should be able to match things up
-do the dimensions make too big a deal? (if i can't get a specific size 5/8th vs 9/16th vs 1/2 inch)
--or hoses like #5 that go from small to big to small?
 

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going off the bolts sizes i should be able to match things up
-do the dimensions make too big a deal? (if i can't get a specific size 5/8th vs 9/16th vs 1/2 inch)
--or hoses like #5 that go from small to big to small?
some guidance on where to go for the hoses would be very helpful

Fragola Performance Systems
I don't understand the question - are you going to use aftermarket hoses for both the pressure and return sides of the system?
 

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Discussion Starter #18 (Edited)
I don't understand the question - are you going to use aftermarket hoses for both the pressure and return sides of the system?

for most of it... except for the cooling coil

so
Hose #1
Hose #5
Hose #8
Hose #15

it's a mess of pre-formed hoses, pressed inside sleeves, pressed inside more sleeves, pressed in shielding

if i'm going to replace all of i'd like to get something that's easier to dismantle regularly
 

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Make sure you get hoses that are rated for power steering - it runs at pretty high pressure (1500 psi+) so you need to make sure what you have can handle it. I'm not sure how you are going to handle the connection to the cooler. YOu can get an adapter to the steering box (IIRC i t is M14 x 1.5). Most of them will be -6 (3/8") Hose #5 is the pressure hose.

You can use "hydraulic" hose which is cheaper and very durable or you can use "racing" braided hose, which is more expensive and braided ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Make sure you get hoses that are rated for power steering - it runs at pretty high pressure (1500 psi+) so you need to make sure what you have can handle it. I'm not sure how you are going to handle the connection to the cooler. YOu can get an adapter to the steering box (IIRC i t is M14 x 1.5). Most of them will be -6 (3/8") Hose #5 is the pressure hose.

You can use "hydraulic" hose which is cheaper and very durable or you can use "racing" braided hose, which is more expensive and braided ;)
that's why i'm hoping someone can direct to some company that makes these hoses since the same people are showing up on google and i have no idea on the quality

if these are the price for hoses rated to 2500-3000psi it'll be well worth it since it'll cost ~$400 in BMW hoses
Hydratech Braking Systems :: Hose, Fittings and Adapter Listings

so if i spend a couple hundred more + the accessories it'll be well worth it

for reference from ECB's thread

Hose #1-clamp + Hose #5-banjo going into the P/S Pump


Hose #8 & Hose #15 going into the cooling coil


Hose #5 running up the middle w/ silver shielding (the hose is flexible, but only if you unbolt one of its ends otherwise it feels as thought its a solid pipe & you can not move it aside to reach the banjo bolts underneath it)
 
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