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Discussion Starter #1
The group buy that many of you have been waiting for...WPC treated rod bearings and ARP bolts. Pointer below to the Group Buy section.

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/m5-e60-group-buy-forum-sponsor-discussion-offerings/422002-group-buy-ptech-norcal-rod-bearings.html#post5430714

Unfortunately, currently the group buy can only be offered to those who will be getting this job done at Performance Technic. If there is enough interest from out-of-towners who want just WPC treated rod bearings and ARP bolts, then I can work with PTech on seeing if we can get that type of a group buy package together.

--Randy
 

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I'm working with Clevite to design a new rod bearing for the S65/S85. The new bearings will allow you to keep the stock size rod journals without resizing, and have safer bearing clearance. They will be a lead/copper bearing plus Clevite Tri-Armor low friction coating. These will be a true upgrade to factory bearings, or WPC treated factory bearings.

If you're inclined to believe the S85/S65 has a rod bearing clearance problem, then these new bearings are designed to solve it.

Production will be completed around May-2015. Depending on the time of your build and/or bearing swap, you might want to consider this option.

I'm not the guy selling the bearings, but I am the guy working with Clevite to make them.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I'm working with Clevite to design a new rod bearing for the S65/S85. The new bearings will allow you to keep the stock size rod journals without resizing, and have safer bearing clearance. They will be a lead/copper bearing plus Clevite Tri-Armor low friction coating. These will be a true upgrade to factory bearings, or WPC treated factory bearings.

If you're inclined to believe the S85/S65 has a rod bearing clearance problem, then these new bearings are designed to solve it.

Production will be completed around May-2015. Depending on the time of your build and/or bearing swap, you might want to consider this option.

I'm not the guy selling the bearings, but I am the guy working with Clevite to make them.
So will the new bearing thickness will be thinner OEM?

I know VAC does coating to OEM bearings and the thickness increases due to the coating and thus there is less clearance. They do claim that their coating lowers the friction though...but in my mind you don't want to go thicker and decrease clearances.
 

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So will the new bearing thickness will be thinner OEM?

I know VAC does coating to OEM bearings and the thickness increases due to the coating and thus there is less clearance. They do claim that their coating lowers the friction though...but in my mind you don't want to go thicker and decrease clearances.
Randy, I'm not sure if you've seen the S65 Bearing Wiki thread on m3post. I'm the guy who created it and ran all the measurements. I have full measurements of VAC coated bearings. But since I'm currently in "timeout" on m3post, I can't post them. As you surmise, it's not good. Using the VAC coated bearings, I've measured clearances as low as 0.00100 inch. That's far too small for this engine.

Further problems with VAC coated bearings are as follows.
1. They habitually mix up uppers (blue) and lowers (red). Since the coating process removes the red/blue paint on the bearings, you must trust their labels. The OEM uppers are thicker than the lowers. But every set of bearings I've measured from VAC show the lowers thicker than the uppers. This means they are being mixed up during the coating process.
2. The coating material is not removed from the parting lines. Extra material on the parting lines changes the bearing "crush" and can lead to deformity when torqued into place. Users should remove the material from the parting lines to prevent this. But how many users do that? I'll bet virtually none.

The Clevite Tri-Armor coating is also a low friction coating. But unlike the VAC/Calico coating, it's done right. The new bearings will have proper clearance, including this coating.

The new bearings are designed to give proper clearance, right in line with the Clevite white paper on bearing clearance. So yes, they will be thinner than OEM.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Randy, I'm not sure if you've seen the S65 Bearing Wiki thread on m3post. I'm the guy who created it and ran all the measurements. I have full measurements of VAC coated bearings. But since I'm currently in "timeout" on m3post, I can't post them. As you surmise, it's not good. Using the VAC coated bearings, I've measured clearances as low as 0.00100 inch. That's far too small for this engine.

Further problems with VAC coated bearings are as follows.
1. They habitually mix up uppers (blue) and lowers (red). Since the coating process removes the red/blue paint on the bearings, you must trust their labels. The OEM uppers are thicker than the lowers. But every set of bearings I've measured from VAC show the lowers thicker than the uppers. This means they are being mixed up during the coating process.
2. The coating material is not removed from the parting lines. Extra material on the parting lines changes the bearing "crush" and can lead to deformity when torqued into place. Users should remove the material from the parting lines to prevent this. But how many users do that? I'll bet virtually none.

The Clevite Tri-Armor coating is also a low friction coating. But unlike the VAC/Calico coating, it's done right. The new bearings will have proper clearance, including this coating.

The new bearings are designed to give proper clearance, right in line with the Clevite white paper on bearing clearance. So yes, they will be thinner than OEM.
ah!! That was your thread? THANK YOU!!! I spent a good amount of time reading that thread and I love that you provided data.

I just had my OEM 088/089 bearings swapped for 702/703 bearings w/ WPC treatment. I've read WPC's site and understand what the treatment is attempting to do and how it adds very, very, very minimal thickness (also seen in your measurements).
 

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ah!! That was your thread? THANK YOU!!! I spent a good amount of time reading that thread and I love that you provided data.

I just had my OEM 088/089 bearings swapped for 702/703 bearings w/ WPC treatment. I've read WPC's site and understand what the treatment is attempting to do and how it adds very, very, very minimal thickness (also seen in your measurements).
Correct about WPC. Today, they are the best approach IMO for people who need to replace the bearings. For those who can hang in there until May-2015, there will be a proper solution, and we'll be back to lead-copper bearings that will be softer, better on the crank journals, and allow better tracking in Blackstone.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Bump about 1.5 months left for this group buy.

For the interested out-of-towners, unfortunately PTech won't be able to provide a shipped package. CA tax sucks so they won't be able to create a package that beats the supposed $940 shipped package that AutoTalent LA is offering for WPC treated rod bearings and ARP bolts.

For those of you locals whom are interested, be sure to contact PTech and pay your $1k deposits before end of February in order to secure this pricing. Last I heard there were 4-5 locals interested in this job. I've driven about 1300 miles since having PTech change my rod bearings and car is running great!

tick tock...
 

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Discussion Starter #8
TTT

One month left to put in your deposits and setup appointments for this GB.

I know a few members have appointments set already for the beginning of Feb.
 
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