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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
:)
So I haven't had a performance car in 12 years. I quit fooling around with cars (I had several cars with lots of mods) to start a business and a family. The business is good, so are my kids. I'm not wealthy and a turbo 911 or Corvette doesn't fit my current lifestyle so a nice low mileage 2008 M5 was just what I was looking for. It's not my daily driver and i'm not afraid to modify the car- But i'm 40 something (all grown up) now and don't want to build a 4 door drag car, just have *more* power that will still be- for the most part- reliable.

My wife thinks it a 535 or a 328 or something classy and anything but the beast it is. She thinks I should have the suspension looked at and the transmission because there is obviously something wrong with both of them- the ride is rough and the shifts are 'jerky' in her words. Some day I will come clean but that time isn't now... My kids are going to rat me out if they don't get blackmail pizza on Fridays "Don't tell Mom".. I'll pay for this.

So I started reading this forum before I found the car and it has been a wealth of info so far and I thank the senior member here for the tips, tricks and experience that are shared for people like me. I read on here recently from another poster that he considered himself a '2nd generation' owner that bought a $40k (or $30k) supercar and felt like some of these new owners would breath a little new life into the E60/61s. I kind of identified with this and I see a lot of posts from 2006-to 2012 that are relevant to my searches and less after that time so I hope I can contribute something here as I own the car and modify it.

I bought my car with 40k miles on it. It has H&R springs on it and I was worried it was a track car for 39k miles but could find no trace of abuse or hard driving. After reading for several weeks here I followed good advice and installed:

E-Mann Race mufflers (with stock cats and stock mid pipe) that gives me the sound that I want without terrorizing my neighbors. I sounds better than an F430 to me.

I removed the stock charcoal filters from the air boxes (thanks again M5Board members!)

I changed the angel eyes over to LED- thanks again for the info guys!

I learned about 50 nifty things about the car from posts on here. Launch control, S6 mode, etc- confusing for a new owner waiting for the owners manual to arrive in the mail. (dealer lost the originals)

I bought the Viseeo Tune2 Air for the radio. Its awesome.

I dynoed the car on the local guys dyno (they work on GTRs 99% of the time) They said a stock GTR makes about 370 on their dyno and the M5 made 387 rwhp. That number seemed to jive with conservative reading from other members here. I just look at it as a baseline number. BTW the mechanics at the shop (remember that 1100 hp GTR's are pretty normal around there) were kind of amazed the sound the ol' V10 made on the rollers. They laughed and said it sounded like a video game audio clip. They loved it even if it didn't make 800 at the wheels and were impressed with the power and curve for an NA engine.

I refinished my headlights following the great advice from a member here. It took forever but they look brand new. My wife keeps asking why I keep working on the 'new' car...

I am buying a few things for the car that I want and they are pretty major mods but I don't know how fast I will get them in- I want to prepare for them now while I get them ordered and ready. I have looked on the forum a bit but honestly the years of information on here make searching somewhat of a endeavor at times. I am purchasing a 5.7 stroker motor (good deal) that I am sending back to be freshened up- It came with a SMG gear box that is in good shape so I basically have spare motor and gear box ready to go. Roman at ESS is going to sell me the supercharger kit/ SC Tune that I may or may not use with the blower (lol, who am I kidding, right?)

Anyway, I have a reasonably extensive automotive background and a whole set of my TV repairman dad's tools (thats a movie quote for you young guys) so I expect that I can work on the car even if it was built by a bunch of genius engineers named Fritz and Hans. What I can't find on M5 board is a link to the OEM technical manuals or really good aftermarket tech manuals so I can understand what I am about to do when I work on the car, know what the part numbers are of the parts I will need and when it goes back together what I need to do/ know when to push it down to the indy shop/ dealer to have something done that I can not do myself. I assume along with the manual I will need diagnosis tools/scan tools.. I see references to 'Auto' something and some other acronyms for what I think is a scan tool from reading. Can you guys enlighten me once more?

Thanks again guys and will post my experiences on here for other that come here like I did.

Jason
 

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Welcome!
let me get this straight, you are not wanting to build a monster dragster, but pulled the trigger on a stroker motor, supercharger kit and tune?

There are a few of us in DFW planning to get together in the coming week. Visit the regional south forum for details. by the way, you are not the only one to have pulled the trigger on an e60 w/o informing the wife!
 

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The software for diagnosis is autologic but it's not cheap. I love the mods you have setup don't forget a set of evolve headers before you put that monster in. As for manuals I don't know if they have but I use Mitchell on demand and alldata and realoem for parts diagrams and part numbers. Euro smg flash is a must for the jerkiness. And also it's all talk without pics :)
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
The software for diagnosis is autologic but it's not cheap. I love the mods you have setup don't forget a set of evolve headers before you put that monster in. As for manuals I don't know if they have but I use Mitchell on demand and alldata and realoem for parts diagrams and part numbers. Euro smg flash is a must for the jerkiness. And also it's all talk without pics :)
Ok I already have the NA e-flash DCM-ECU-whatever/SMG tune on the way here with the cable- it going on tomorrow. I read about ESS tune vs Euro tunes and decided that since you need all the ESS stuff with the blower then I might as well just go ahead and get it while I was on the website.

So go of the Evolve headers? As far as the headers (and I guess Dinan TB could be inserted here too) I have read years of posts going back and forth on this site about what power the headers and/or TBs really offer as in power gains. Some of what I read was typical forum discussion- some guys were all about it power gains, some we not, some guys seemed like they were defending their purchases but all in all it seemed pretty subjective. The dyno numbers were within the error bar of reported M5 dyno reading spread and some posters were waiting for adaptation periods to happen before they saw/felt a difference. I think I read the Evolve headers had bigger cats, correct? if so that makes more sense that some of the other header setups I see for sale- its not like the factory ones are crap cast iron log manifolds and after reading a few years of post it seems like you could be switching out pretty nice factory headers for shiny new $2K brand X headers that may not make any significant increase in power unless you delete the cats. I'm still confused on the headers.


Thanks for the Autologic and other suggestions- thats just about exactly what I needed. LOL- It really IS all talk until the motor is back and i'm turning wrenches but I want to get all the materials together before I rip into it.

At least I have obligatory pics and vid...


<embed width="440" height="420" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" src="http://v8.tinypic.com/player.swf?file=4gqfbl&s=8"><br><font size="1"><a href="http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=4gqfbl&s=8">Original Video</a> - More videos at <a href="http://tinypic.com">TinyPic</a></font>
 

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The most reliable diagnostic software you can get for the SMG and S85 is BMW's ISTA/D coupled with INPA. Search a bit and you can find a good setup. I believe EUAutohuas had a good setup not too long ago. Typically with a cable, you can find it under $200.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
lol so whats the wife going to say when she sees you installing a new motor?
Dude, give me a little credit- A long time ago a two post car lift was secretly installed in the back of my companies fabrication shop for emergencies such as this. The only women ever allowed back there would have arrived in a shipping container from some country like Belarus.* :M5thumbs:











*I do not condone the international trafficking of super-hot Eastern European women with names like Natalia or Svetlana...
 

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Welcome to the forum.
I would not push too much power on a stroker as they have not been tested with a SC kit and even DINAN would not work with me on doing this project.

Wish you the best on your project.
 

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Dude, give me a little credit- A long time ago a two post car lift was secretly installed in the back of my companies fabrication shop for emergencies such as this. The only women ever allowed back there would have arrived in a shipping container from some country like Belarus.* :M5thumbs:










*I do not condone the international trafficking of super-hot Eastern European women with names like Natalia or Svetlana...

sick man! i will soon be installing a post in my garage. Im curious to know that kinda of business you started as stated in your original post?
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Welcome to the forum.
I would not push too much power on a stroker as they have not been tested with a SC kit and even DINAN would not work with me on doing this project.

Wish you the best on your project.
Thanks for the advice. I have read a lot of your post regarding your build. I like what you did and it made sense (and power.) Roman at ESS surprised me when I asked about SC/stroker motors- He said there was several now and one was in their shop at the moment. I had read on here (well, the post was circa 2012) that he had said no one had stepped up with a 5.7 S85 for a SC kit yet.

As for Dinan I would assume that they would no bid the blower/stroker combo- if I was Steve Dinan I would too. I didn't spend anywhere near the $30k on the motor Dinan charges for a new one and while I wouldn't want to go blow it up on a 200mph boost pass the stroker is probably going to get mated to the blower because I have them both.

If I keep the boost reasonable I would expect to see some accelerated wear on the bottom end of the motor vs other combinations but I don't expect rods to be departing the engine via the side of the block on a regular basis.

Even stroked the motor is still over square, the piston speed is still pretty low and the compression (at 12:1 ) is still lower than the Audi V10- and I know people that have added turbo kits to them with out issue.
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
sick man! i will soon be installing a post in my garage. Im curious to know that kinda of business you started as stated in your original post?

Ident
Part of my company's name is my board name! Its not car stuff but we work some cool/high tech stuff.

I guess that link is a bit of a segway... I saw someone here post a pic a while back of the HK MP5 mount for the M5 and read you couldn't get them from BMW. I called a buddy that works close with various German law enforcement entities, lol. Asked him to make it happen. Never know- maybe I can somehow lay my hands on one. That mount is pretty neat- I think it articulates out as you lower the rear armrest because the weapon sticks out past the top of the armrest when its in the lowered position. I'd doubt it would see much use but i thinks its such a unobtainable factory option that I want one. Besides, who wants their MP5 sliding all over the trunk as you drift around a cloverleaf on the way home? :)
 

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Welcome to the board, good luck with the wife... :)
 

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12:1 compression is high for a boosted car so I would expect to see lower psi being pushed on a 5.7 engine. I went the opposite direction as I wanted to boost more so dropped compression.
I am actually in AZ right now for the week and will be discussing my next phase with AJ as I am planning on pushing 15psi :) There is no end in sight for me just yet LOL!!

Thanks for the advice. I have read a lot of your post regarding your build. I like what you did and it made sense (and power.) Roman at ESS surprised me when I asked about SC/stroker motors- He said there was several now and one was in their shop at the moment. I had read on here (well, the post was circa 2012) that he had said no one had stepped up with a 5.7 S85 for a SC kit yet.

As for Dinan I would assume that they would no bid the blower/stroker combo- if I was Steve Dinan I would too. I didn't spend anywhere near the $30k on the motor Dinan charges for a new one and while I wouldn't want to go blow it up on a 200mph boost pass the stroker is probably going to get mated to the blower because I have them both.

If I keep the boost reasonable I would expect to see some accelerated wear on the bottom end of the motor vs other combinations but I don't expect rods to be departing the engine via the side of the block on a regular basis.

Even stroked the motor is still over square, the piston speed is still pretty low and the compression (at 12:1 ) is still lower than the Audi V10- and I know people that have added turbo kits to them with out issue.
 

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I hope your wife doesn't see the M5 badges in the side grills and door sills, and use google.
Welcome! Sounds like you're building a real beast, you may have to come clean sooner than you think.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
12:1 compression is high for a boosted car so I would expect to see lower psi being pushed on a 5.7 engine. I went the opposite direction as I wanted to boost more so dropped compression.
I am actually in AZ right now for the week and will be discussing my next phase with AJ as I am planning on pushing 15psi :) There is no end in sight for me just yet LOL!!
Roman said the blower/stroker wasn't a big top end power increase but a large midrange power increase. Funny, I might have to dash out to AZ for work next week and I thought about stopping by to see the car Roman was talking about. If you see that car there I would appreciate any info you might be able to glean with your experience you have on your car. Maybe well run it each other!

This motor with forced induction using low comp vs high comp is really a bit of a conundrum. You could argue advantages or negatives either way on a number of different areas. I want all the upside of the NA motor and am counting on the small about of boost the I could run at 12:1 to give me the power I want the car to have. I would really like to see a car like yours with lower comp and more boost- have you looked at pre and post air charge temps at the high boost? What trim are you using? Still the SI trim?
 

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Roman said the blower/stroker wasn't a big top end power increase but a large midrange power increase. Funny, I might have to dash out to AZ for work next week and I thought about stopping by to see the car Roman was talking about. If you see that car there I would appreciate any info you might be able to glean with your experience you have on your car. Maybe well run it each other!

This motor with forced induction using low comp vs high comp is really a bit of a conundrum. You could argue advantages or negatives either way on a number of different areas. I want all the upside of the NA motor and am counting on the small about of boost the I could run at 12:1 to give me the power I want the car to have. I would really like to see a car like yours with lower comp and more boost- have you looked at pre and post air charge temps at the high boost? What trim are you using? Still the SI trim?
I just got off the phone with ESS and he mentioned that the pick up in power is only in the midrange which is where I had expected it to be, I ran the numbers with a stroker 2.5 years back to gain better understanding on expected gains. The overall power increase is somewhere around 10hp at top end over a standard 5.0 V10 with a VT2 which again makes sense. I am here till Tuesday of next week but for work so will not have time it actually see the car but as Roman put it "it's nothing outstanding" lol.

I am still using the same blower that comes with the VT2 kit but with an upgraded belt system to boost more along with fuel system changes and tune, can't tell you what the intake temps where before and after as I have some other items installed to keep temps down. The blower will be changing to a new setup as I continue my journey.

I have a few more phases to go through before I put this project to rest.
 

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I've seen an M6 with a 5.7 Stroker, ESS VT2 and 3.91 diff. 1 Big problem with that car - traction. Even 305's were spinning into 3rd. People don't seem to realize that power is useless unless you can put it down. Why do you think porsches are so flippin fast with these miniscule engines compared to the rest?

Unless you do a wide body m5 with very wide wheels, I don't see how it would work at all based on seeing it already done on an M6.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I hope your wife doesn't see the M5 badges in the side grills and door sills, and use google.
Welcome! Sounds like you're building a real beast, you may have to come clean sooner than you think.

If your car was available here I would have bought it in a second- I owned a Mitsu Galant VR4 estate at one time! Awesome sleeper. Wife would have never figured it out. If she Googles i'm going down. Last time I pulled a stunt I got to show her several countries in Europe in style.
 
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