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Discussion Starter #1
I have an '04 M3 - anyway, here's my post from the Bimmer.org board ...
One of my business associates gives me a call for advice on an issue on his '00 M5 - here's the chain of events...
- Check engine light on for the last week - dealer runs diagnostics - says the cat convertor needs replacement - replaced - problem still persists.
- Dealer then changes engine exhaust pump - problem still exists - total bill at this stage $4500!
- Yesterday he gets a call - says they need to remove engine to clean carbon build-up on exhaust ports and around valves - estimate - $5k - about 50 hours labor...apparently engine needs to be removed to get to the heads!
Car has about 70k miles and no extended warranty - the owner had the car from new and it was driven fairly hard (imo - it was built to be) - anyone hear of similar issues with a high mileage E39 M5?
 

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BMW has a emmission warranty to 80k miles. Cats replacement should be under warranty. Ask your friend to get a refund if he got charged for the Cats.



m34me2 said:
I have an '04 M3 - anyway, here's my post from the Bimmer.org board ...
One of my business associates gives me a call for advice on an issue on his '00 M5 - here's the chain of events...
- Check engine light on for the last week - dealer runs diagnostics - says the cat convertor needs replacement - replaced - problem still persists.
- Dealer then changes engine exhaust pump - problem still exists - total bill at this stage $4500!
- Yesterday he gets a call - says they need to remove engine to clean carbon build-up on exhaust ports and around valves - estimate - $5k - about 50 hours labor...apparently engine needs to be removed to get to the heads!
Car has about 70k miles and no extended warranty - the owner had the car from new and it was driven fairly hard (imo - it was built to be) - anyone hear of similar issues with a high mileage E39 M5?
 

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m34me2 said:
I have an '04 M3 - anyway, here's my post from the Bimmer.org board ...
One of my business associates gives me a call for advice on an issue on his '00 M5 - here's the chain of events...
- Check engine light on for the last week - dealer runs diagnostics - says the cat convertor needs replacement - replaced - problem still persists.
- Dealer then changes engine exhaust pump - problem still exists - total bill at this stage $4500!
- Yesterday he gets a call - says they need to remove engine to clean carbon build-up on exhaust ports and around valves - estimate - $5k - about 50 hours labor...apparently engine needs to be removed to get to the heads!
Car has about 70k miles and no extended warranty - the owner had the car from new and it was driven fairly hard (imo - it was built to be) - anyone hear of similar issues with a high mileage E39 M5?
if he has less that 80k on the clock... the cats should have been free under federal emissions warranty

and yes... I have heard of that

what problems (other than the light) was he experiencing... hesitation, cold start up...
 

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m34me2 said:
I have an '04 M3 - anyway, here's my post from the Bimmer.org board ...
One of my business associates gives me a call for advice on an issue on his '00 M5 - here's the chain of events...
- Check engine light on for the last week - dealer runs diagnostics - says the cat convertor needs replacement - replaced - problem still persists.
- Dealer then changes engine exhaust pump - problem still exists - total bill at this stage $4500!
- Yesterday he gets a call - says they need to remove engine to clean carbon build-up on exhaust ports and around valves - estimate - $5k - about 50 hours labor...apparently engine needs to be removed to get to the heads!
Car has about 70k miles and no extended warranty - the owner had the car from new and it was driven fairly hard (imo - it was built to be) - anyone hear of similar issues with a high mileage E39 M5?
This is a BMW dealer?! Get the money back from the cat replacement as stated by dmz above. I would also ask for the exhaust pump to be refunded as this was obviously not the problem as well. After that....run as fast as you can away from this dealer.

Whats next? Replace the engine to clear the check engine light?! ouich

Mark
 

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I never understood how dealership can get away with replacing random parts which does not fix the problem and yet still bill the repair like that is what's supposed to happen. As far as I am concerrn if you can't prove that a part caused the problem I am not paying for it.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Dealership is on the Eastside! - spoke to my buddy - car did start having intermittant cold start issues for a couple months - here's the latest:-
Original cats and pump reinstalled - no charge for that.
Waiting for NA rep to discuss removal of engine issue...
Bad fuel can be ruled out...he's meticulous about Shell....
Car has been driven fairly hard as well....
 

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dmz said:
I never understood how dealership can get away with replacing random parts which does not fix the problem and yet still bill the repair like that is what's supposed to happen. As far as I am concerrn if you can't prove that a part caused the problem I am not paying for it.

Exactly!

My local BMW dealership here in Helsinki, Finland, never charges me for anything that did not fix the problem. That can't be legal under law, to randomly change parts! I had my M5 in for repairs about a moth ago, the ABS modul gave in. They first thought it to be a ABS sensor, changed it, but after 5min the warning light came on again. Change the module, about 2h work + parts, it was broken from the beginning, new part arrived, changed it, and everything worked.
Due to the fact that I had to come in 3times to get it fixed, thay left the new ABS sensor in at no cost, and removed all work hours from the invoice, all I had to pay was the new and working ABS module at 900euros. Now this is the way it should be!

This dealership is awsome!
:M5thumbs:
 

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My local dealer said it had the same carbon build-up problem, and refused to fix it period. Took to an another dealer, and said it was nothing to worry about. Changed cats and pump on mine as well, still no luck. Then changed the o2 sensors twice and still no luck. I changed the MAFS myself, and seems to be ok so far.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
What was the mileage on yours when the problem started? Also, sorry for ignorance - is MAFS Air Flow meter? What was the cost?
 

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That dealer and the mechanics are total idiots, tell your friend to stay as far away from that dealer as possible, in the Air Force we call these type of mechanics parts swappers, they don't have clue as to the problem so they randomly select certain parts based on their very limited experience and choice, only to find that they're completely wrong, the only thing that will fix his car is a very knowledgeable mechanic and decent dianostic computer, not an idiot who has who needs a computer to determine what actions to take.
It's truly a shame BMW charges so much for these cars yet fail to ensure the M5 enthusiast have access to knowledgeable mechanics, guess that's the best way to sell a new M5 is to make it very difficult for used M5 owners.
SHAME, SHAME, SHAME BMW
 

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Garcia said:
It's truly a shame BMW charges so much for these cars yet fail to ensure the M5 enthusiast have access to knowledgeable mechanics, guess that's the best way to sell a new M5 is to make it very difficult for used M5 owners.
SHAME, SHAME, SHAME BMW

I feel your pain, If it wasn't for the knowl found on forums like this... my car might never get fixed


and to the other poster... MAF = MAss Aif Flow Meter
 

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I also have a 00' M5. My buddies were telling me that I had smoke coming out of my tailpipes when step on the gas hard. So I called up Seattle BMW and they determined that my heads had excessive carbon buildup. They gave me a loaner car, replaced my heads, installed an updated VANOS, and replaced my MAF's. No problems now.

So...., if it is the heads that need to be replaced, big money my friend. But my problem did go away.

Bojan
 

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BMW has a emission warranty to 80k miles. Cats replacement should be under warranty.
The engine exhaust pump is also an emissions device, I think and should also be subject to the federally mandated emissions warranty. In general I agree with the other posters. A little knowledge is an expensive thing! :confused:
 

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My opinion is that it would be nuts to let these guys take the engine out of the car. Imagine the nightmare!

Is everyone convinced that its even necessary to remove the engine form the car to get the heads off? I'm not so sure about that
 

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Need4Spd said:
The engine exhaust pump is also an emissions device, I think and should also be subject to the federally mandated emissions warranty. In general I agree with the other posters. A little knowledge is an expensive thing! :confused:
No, the 8yr/80K applies only to a very small and specific list of emission-related components; the list was defined a long time ago.

Includes cats, ECU, and not much else. There's a doc out on the EPA website that lists exactly what's covered but I don't have time to find it right now.
 
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