[Pip]

As a new member, I am probably bringing up something that has already been thrashed out but here goes. The E39 has an unusual and difficult to source engine oil ie you cannot pop down to Halfords and pick a bottle up.

My understanding was that an oil of this viscosity only showed its true colours in colder temperatures and in a normal temperate environment the difference between this viscosity and a more everyday oil would be marginal.

Could you use something else in an emergency or even in a non emergency?

Pip

 

[willm5ad]

When I bought my car around 3 months ago it had normal oil and ran like a bag of sh1t I had the engine flushed and changed the oil for RS fully synthetic and the difference was incredible, my opinion is that you should always use fully synthetic oil as the engine does reach much higher temperatures than non-M cars and normal oil basically has the quality of water and will damage your engine.

Thats my opinion for what its worth.
WillM5AD

 

[Ashok Arora]

Pip - Mobil1 is widely available and ok to use in an emergency.

You may find the following of interest to you:

http://www.castrol.com/castrol/genericarticle.do?categoryId=8264018&contentId=6003233

Hope you can come along to our meet next Sunday :cheers:

 

[Carrera2RS]

Please check the previous oil threads. 10/60 Castrol TWS is the correct oil, another 10/60 would in theory suffice ditto Mobil 1.

I spoke to a few people at Castrol there IS A DIFFERENCE between Castrol RS and TWS, the difference relating to particulants additives and sepcific formulation to work with the filtration system and the Vanos system.

It's expensive and I did obtain some sensibly priced Catrol Racing 10/60 that is a specific formulation for the Ascari BMW engines (It's actually TWS by another name) However the retail is no cheaper, I just know some people in Racing......

If I was unable to buy cheap I would of paid full price for TWS, A replacement engine is not cheap, cheap oil is a false economy............

 

[Ashok Arora]

There is usually a group buy of TWS going on for members over at www.bm5w.co.uk

I can confirm that TWS and RS are two different products - stick with TWS.

 

[willm5ad]

Please check the previous oil threads. 10/60 Castrol TWS is the correct oil, another 10/60 would in theory suffice ditto Mobil 1.

I spoke to a few people at Castrol there IS A DIFFERENCE between Castrol RS and TWS, the difference relating to particulants additives and sepcific formulation to work with the filtration system and the Vanos system.

It's expensive and I did obtain some sensibly priced Catrol Racing 10/60 that is a specific formulation for the Ascari BMW engines (It's actually TWS by another name) However the retail is no cheaper, I just know some people in Racing......

If I was unable to buy cheap I would of paid full price for TWS, A replacement engine is not cheap, cheap oil is a false economy............

I will check it out as I live in Abu Dhabi might be a problem getting hold of it but the RS cost me around £60 for 5 liters

 

[shadowman]

As a new member, I am probably bringing up something that has already been thrashed out but here goes. The E39 has an unusual and difficult to source engine oil ie you cannot pop down to Halfords and pick a bottle up.

My understanding was that an oil of this viscosity only showed its true colours in colder temperatures and in a normal temperate environment the difference between this viscosity and a more everyday oil would be marginal.

Could you use something else in an emergency or even in a non emergency?

Pip

Your last question first....... ANY oil is better than no oil in an emerency.......

Now as to whether you should consider the OEM BMW recomended Castrol 10-60 BMW recomended oil...... absoulutely. I am certain that others will work however from all that I have seen and been told I think the risk is greater than I would take when one considers the investment you have made with your M5 and the fact that much of what the M5 is revolves around it's heart. There has been so much talk about the cost...... I agree that it seems a bit exteme and distribution somewhat controlled however......... your car was expensive and it's distribution was controlled too. I am not supporting them only bringing this fact to light again.

I can share that a few weeks ago I received a call from a fellow that I do business with and he and his team were prepared to run in a new Porsche engine with associated extreme testing and they were unable to locate tis oil. I had 3 cases shipped overnight from California to New York because they would NOT fire the engine with a substitute oil........ now this is a factual story that I shared....... I did not participate in the firing of the engine nonetheless it futher validates my feelings about this oil......and that other Marques reconize it's premium value too.

Viscosity of the oils plays a BIG part on the motors like M5. There are so many extremely small passages that need to be feed oil long before the oil temperature rises to a point that alternate viscocity oils will thin out.....then consider the additives incorporated into the oil, they are most often what truly makes an oil unique.....these are pressure additives, cleaning, etc........... that fluid we call simply oil......is your motor's blood and does much more than simply keep the bearings alive.

Take care.

Shadowman

 

[SC'dKellenersM5]

Just remember that prior to a official oil spec change..the specified oil for the S62 was 5W-30 Castrol/BMW oil. BMW has since wisened up because of the continuing problems with the S54 engine out of the current E46 M3, and mandated that all S-spec engines run the Castrol 10W-60.

In a pinch, half a quart of mobil 1 or castrol/BMW 5w-30 would not hurt...but always always use the 10W60 if avail.

 

[howler]

I beg to differ with you comment concerning the factory recommended oil type for the S62 engine.
I questioned my service advisor when I brought my 03 M5 in for the 1200 service because of the many threads on this Board concerning this subject .
He showed me the service bulletin that clearly stated that 02-03 M5's run Castrol 5x-30 not 10w-60.
I live in Arizona, so I was concerned about its performance in the extreme heat. Not being totally satisfied with this answer, I went to there Technical Service Manager who gave me the same comments. So, I knuckled under and had the 5w-30 put in.
The Beast currently has over 6,500 miles on it and it has only burnt about a quart since I had the oil changed at 1,200 miles.
I may have a change of heart the next time I change it if I can be persuaded to do so.
Just my opinion.

Just remember that prior to a official oil spec change..the specified oil for the S62 was 5W-30 Castrol/BMW oil. BMW has since wisened up because of the continuing problems with the S54 engine out of the current E46 M3, and mandated that all S-spec engines run the Castrol 10W-60.

In a pinch, half a quart of mobil 1 or castrol/BMW 5w-30 would not hurt...but always always use the 10W60 if avail.

 

[SC'dKellenersM5]

you can argue all you want sir...but BMW has since stated that both oils are ok to run but they would prefer the 10W-60 due to the higher protection levels that it offers, especially under race loads and high temps. I had 3 of my crank bearings let go and it was due to an oil starvation problem and the district warranty official stated that i should run the 10W-60 to minimize that from ever occuring again.

One of at least 50 threads that state this..

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=25018&highlight=Castrol+10W-60

Since you are in an area prone to high temps (i love AZ summers though...) I would HIGHLY recommend that you speak with your advisors and ask them about the TSB's that were issued concerning this very topic. In addition, i would suggest that you also change to the 10W-60 as it is the far supperior oil to the 5W30. I would not recommend this so highly if my car had not been damaged and partially due to this issue. I know its not cheap oil (@ around 9.00/qt) but its the oil that offers the most protection of the engine. $130 oil changes to protect the $20,000 engine in your car.

I would again bring up this issue with your service advisor. If you would care to look at more threads on the issues, i typed in "Castrol 10W-60" in the search function. I suggest you might try the same key words

 

[shadowman]

I beg to differ with you comment concerning the factory recommended oil type for the S62 engine.
I questioned my service advisor when I brought my 03 M5 in for the 1200 service because of the many threads on this Board concerning this subject .
He showed me the service bulletin that clearly stated that 02-03 M5's run Castrol 5x-30 not 10w-60.
I live in Arizona, so I was concerned about its performance in the extreme heat. Not being totally satisfied with this answer, I went to there Technical Service Manager who gave me the same comments. So, I knuckled under and had the 5w-30 put in.
The Beast currently has over 6,500 miles on it and it has only burnt about a quart since I had the oil changed at 1,200 miles.
I may have a change of heart the next time I change it if I can be persuaded to do so.
Just my opinion.

No worries and absolutely no concerns regarding your difference of opinions. I encourage them and the fact and experienced answers that follow.

The oil debate has be going on a long time...... some of the cars came with 5-30 stickers...others with 10-60 stickers. Even the dealerships seem to have different factory notes to refer to. My only suggestion is that you do you research and find the oil you can remain comfortable with. The most important issue that I was attempting to share is that oil is more a combination additives that have been requested by the specific OEM to protect their motor based on design and not simply a difference in viscosity. The fact that your particular motor only sips oil is a reflection of the sealing of the rings and the valve guides and seals and has nothing to do with whether the protection being provided within is adequate.

Enjoy your car; it sounds like you take a lot of proud and maintain her well.

Best regards,

Shadowman

 

[Carrera2RS]

Since BMW do change their approach when statistics of servicing and issues come to light I would be sorely tempted to simply stick with the concensus oil, TWS 10/60.

If I had not of spoken to Castrol technical I would be using Mobil 1, which is an excellent oil, but not designed to work with the M5 engine specifically, better safe than sorry !

 

[MAH]

I have not seen the particulat bulletins from BMW regarding oil, but I do know that my 2000 M5 used 10W-60 and had an appetite of about 1 quart per 1500 miles.

My 2001 M5 uses perhaps 1 quart of 5W-30 Castrol every 4000 miles. Of course the sticker in the engine compartment and the maual indicate this is the correct oil. My question would be if your car tends to need more oil than 1 quart per 2000 miles, are better off with with the 10W-60?

I realize there is probably no absolute answer, but I was just wondering.

Mark

 

[FAST 5]

What happens if you do a "custom blend" mix, poured into the engine?

Since the newer motors are supposed to use the 5W-30 weight motor oil and the older ones are to use the heavier oil weight, 10W-60, what would happen if one were to pour into the engine, a half & half mixture. By doing so, your oil weight is now not as thick as the Motor Sport engine oil, and not as thin as the 5W-30 grade motor oil. Is this okay to do? What would the ramifications be, if any???
Thank you.
Robert

 

[RRoberts]

My car is an early 2001. I started using 10w-60 oil at the 1200 mile change, at the advice of the SA, despite the 5w-30 sticker and the information provided in the owner's manual. I have been using this oil ever since. I change oil at 3-4000 mile intervals. The car has 17,000 miles, and is typically down about 1/2 quart at oil change time. I have never needed to add oil, including track use. I see no reason to use any other oil than Castrol TWS 10w-60 in this engine.

I know opinions vary on this subject, with many factors cited pro and con.

Regards, Dick Roberts

 

[SC'dKellenersM5]

Robert,

trust me man...its fine to run the 5w30 until you can have it changed over...and if you need to top it off, use the 10w60. Its just like adding a oil booster to your oil...it wont harm a thing

 

[DaveK]

I just looked at the paperwork and saw that the dealer put 5W30 in my '00 back in March, a few thousand miles ago, even though I specifically mentioned that 10W60 oil was required and was assured that they were aware of it.

Not long after that I had this problem with VANOS seals http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=42013 which was fixed under warrantee, but I didn't catch the oil difference until now.

Could that or other problems that have yet to surface (maybe the recent SES light is related) have been caused by the wrong oil?

I'm bringing it in Thursday to have them check into the SES light and put the correct oil in. Hopefully any related or other problems will show up before it's CPO warrantee runs out in about 18 months.

- Dave

 

[FAST 5]

Question for Mr. Roberts and others.......

My car is an early 2001. I started using 10w-60 oil at the 1200 mile change, at the advice of the SA, despite the 5w-30 sticker and the information provided in the owner's manual. I have been using this oil ever since. I change oil at 3-4000 mile intervals. The car has 17,000 miles, and is typically down about 1/2 quart at oil change time. I have never needed to add oil, including track use. I see no reason to use any other oil than Castrol TWS 10w-60 in this engine.

I know opinions vary on this subject, with many factors cited pro and con.

Regards, Dick Roberts

I would rather have the heavier weight oil dumped into my motor, over the 5W-30 grade engine oil, but here's my situation.
When you open the engine hood on my 2003 model M5, there's a sticker which tells the technician to use the 5W-30 weight motor oil, instead of the 10W-60 oil.
Being that my car has the full maintenance, the dealer does the oil changed for free every 15,000. I pay for the oil change/service at the 5000 mile mark,so I pay for the oil change twice before the dealer does it for free which would be at the 15000 mile mark. I want to stay consistant with the oil changes, in other words I wouldn't want to have the dealer do the free oil change using the lighter 5W-30 weight oil, and then I have it changed 5000 miles later and tell them to use the heavier oil. Im not sure this would be good for the motor. :confused3
Obviously the lighter motor oil is less expensive for the dealer, so how do I convince them to use the more expensive 10W-60 engine oil and put it under the maintenance plan, charging BMW for this type of oil change. Im sure the dealer will tell me they will not get paid by BMW for the more expensive motor oil, so they will make me pay for the supposed "free" oil change. How do I convince the dealer to use the 10W-60 weight oil???
I tried this once ( a long time ago) and the service dept. told me they have a notice for my model year car to only use the lighter of the two motor oils. Guys what can I do??? Please help with advise on this matter.
Thank you.
Robert :crying:

 

[SC'dKellenersM5]

Robert,

what you need to do is get yourself a copy of that TSB that stated that the oil is RECOMMENDED to be 10W60. Take it to your dealer and see what they say...i think it also has to do with how cheap the dealer is or is not.

 

[RRoberts]

Robert:

Here's another idea. Go to the parts department and ask to buy the sticker that they have in stock to put on all the E46 M3s that have bad bearings. It is orange and black, and specifies 10w60 oil. The cost, if I recall, was $0.30 (the cheapest thing I ever got from BMW). It neatly covers the green and black 5w30 sticker on the front apron. Then the tech will put in 10w60.

I put one of these on my car because, when I took it in for an oil change: the SA agreed to put in 10w60 oil; the tech did this; then the tech noticed the 5w30 sticker, and dumped the fresh 10w60 oil and replaced it with 5w30; when this was explained to me. I insisted that they drain the fresh 5w30 oil and put back in 10w60 as I had originally requested; the tech then did this. I probably had the cleanest engine in town.

Regards, Dick Roberts