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Discussion Starter #1
I am sorry if this puts a bad taste in any ones mouth, but I am not used to my car having so many problems. I have had my car 14 weeks and already have had to replace this:

ENGINE!! After three weeks
Hood Struts
Top Windshield Seal
Windshield washer Pump
Alternator

I traded in my Pontiac G8 that had 108k miles, and as long as I owned that car i NEVER had to replace ANYTHING
I also sold my Chrysler Pacifica which had 220k, and I only had to replace suspension stuff.

Why is a $100k car like the M5 riddled with issues?? Don't they beat down on their suppliers to make better components??
I log on here everyday and see issues that I am hoping I never have to deal with, but I just know it's a matter of time. I know everyone says "Get a Warranty", which I have, but my warranty had not even kicked in yet when the engine went.
Everyone beats down American cars for quality issues, but I never had a car leave me stranded on the side of the freeway like My M5 did me on Tuesday. Don't get me wrong, I love my car, and yes it is a step up from what I had, but I now own a car that my wife will not touch because she is scared of it leaving her stranded. WTF BMW?? I think it's time to stop kissing their asses and make them realize that they DO NOT put quality first in their products. I got a printout from the service department on all the warranty fixes my car had from the previous owners... HOLY CRAP! It was three pages long! No wonder he sold it! I am pissed that I can not trust a car I spent my hard earned money for, and I blame the manufacturer.
 

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I do see where you are coming from but you have to understand a car like this with already 50k+ miles is going to have issues big or small. Even the regular 3 series for example will have problems but they won't cost as much as a M car. All the issues you are posting about are normal with the age of your car and miles. If I remember correctly your car is in the 70k mileage range? And is 6-7 years old already. The only thing I will say is the engine part that is unacceptable, I agree.

It's been well documented online about the possible rod bearing issues with the S85 and S65 motors. That's why I insist anyone who is in the market for one of these cars or any M car for that matter do plenty of research before purchasing so they know what they're getting into. I bet half the owners of the cars now if they actually researched before purchasing wouldn't own of these. A lot of people see the attractive price but forget what else causes that price to be so low.

The cars you are comparing to are not in the same category as the M5, I'm afraid. What I've learned growing up with always high performance motor vehicles around is whatever the original price tag of that car always expect the maintenance of that car to resemble it.

Also, this is not only a BMW issue it is with all the high end manufactures. All my father's Mercedes S Class AMGs we have owned have been plagued with the ABC suspension system faults, one repair was over $10k in a single visit JUST FOR THE SUSPENSION. But we knew what we were getting into as I researched the cars and we purchased an extended warranty.


It's simple, if you want a car that has a predictable maintanence future and low cost ownership do not purchase any German or Italian vehicle, period. If you want a car that delivers a driving experience like none other on the road purchase a German or Italian car.
 

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Sounds like you have got a real lemon! Perhaps you should consider selling it and get another one, since the problems have been persistent? Three pages with repairs, must mean that it's been going on for quite a while.
I had mine for more than three years and had no real issues with it. None caused by bad quality, at least. Either I was lucky, or they've pressed down the prices of the parts over the years of production.
Just out of curiosity; how many miles on the clock?

Edit: However, I also agree with SuckaGDog, that you're not comparing apples and apples with the cars you replaced.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I hear what both of you are saying. It is just frustrating. I would just expect the quality of a 100k car to be a lot better than a 35k car. ESPECIALLY with higher miles. OK, I have a high performance engine. But in my opinion, hood struts, windshield trim, and a windshield washer pump should last the life of the car. Send your engineers back to the drawing board and make that little stuff last! I used to work for Delphi which was a supplier to GM. Man, they used to beat the crap out of us for quality. Every customer complaint, warranty issue, got back to us. They forever threatened to cut us off. They took complaints and warranty issues seriously when it came to suppliers.
 

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I think you have just had back luck or a bad car, i got my car 2 years ago with 27k miles.

Im at like 63k now, the only thing i have had to do is Oil changes, tires, diff fluid, and a oil level sensor which I'm not even sure if it went out but i replaced it cause i couldn't figure out what the hell was going on with my oil level indicator

At like 49k miles BMW seattle did spark plugs and cabin filters and air filters under warranty and maintenance
other then that its been Perfect, best car i have ever owned, i let it warm up before beating on it and change the oil every 5k miles and drive it like i stole it

Ive said it a million times, it makes no sense but i have found cars like to be used and pushed, most of my friends baby there cars and have all kinds of issues, i enjoy mine and use them like they are meant to be ( Which is very different from just abusing something) and they perform great and last a long time

Now if my rob bearings will hold up ill be happy or calling troy for a stoker
 

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DinanS2+ e60m5 6MT, s38b38 e28m5 TT/ST3, e30 TT/ST4
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///M the ///Most Expensive Letter in the Alphabet! BMW gave us bespoke F1 engines, but never gave us F1 budgets to keep them running in top form. I don't think BMW is building garbage. After the m62/s62, we clamored for a bespoke engine from Motorsport; they gave us the s85, a F1 v10 that require high costs to maintain -- nothing new.

I've daily driven/tracked my s85 for the last 80,000 miles without any issues and had my rod bearings replaced 22,000 miles ago, as preventive maintenance. My warranty expired 56,000 ago. None of the preventative maintenance I performed, while I was under warranty, was covered by the warranty. What was the point of the warranty?

I think too many previous owners (and lessees) blindly followed BMW's free maintenance (which means NO MAINTENANCE) and CBS service intervals. Why come out of pocket to perform additional maintenance -- what's the point, when a warranty will cover anything catastrophic. Lease return...forget it. I had E350 company cars that I drove into the dirt, full records and serviced at the dealership. Valet service...sure, why not! Because it was a "rental" car -- heck, it didn't even get garage space over the m5s.

As second or third owners, we can potentially bear the brunt of the previous neglect of missed/deferred maintenance. I'm sorry for your headaches, but no car from ///Motorsport, including the e28, has been cheap to maintain.
 

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You can't blame BMW for what the previous owner(s) did to abuse or didn't do to maintain that car since new. BMW puts a 4 yr/50,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty, with free scheduled maintenance (for the original owner at least) on their new cars. That's why they cost $100K new. If you wanted that kind of assurance on a 6-year old car that you probably got for a steal, you need to pony up for a good warranty. You get what you pay for...IMO
 

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I have no sympathy as it sounds like you didn't get the car inspected properly prior to purchase in regards to the engine. The other items I can definitely see going on higher mileage cars, that's just part of the game.
 

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Unfortunately buying an expensive car does not mean that you will have less problems, usually means expect to pay more when they break down :crying:

That is one reason why we say if you don't have a warranty then prepare to have a lot of money saved when a new member joins and starts asking what do I need to look for as I am buying a 30k used M5.

I feel you on the engine replacement as that is the only thing I would not have expected to be replaced but who knows how it was driven prior to your purchase.
 

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Sorry to hear all the issues you've had with your car. I've had my M6 for almost 3 years now, I had to replace the starter and a sensor under warranty, other than that the last 30,000 miles I've put on the car have been fantastic.

This may not make you feel better, but be thankful you don't own a Ferrari 355, that car has high maintenance cost.
 

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Regarding engine/drivetrain and the maintenance thereof, it's really quite simple: if it performs like a Ferrari or Lambo, then expect the need and cost for service and maintenance to be on par with them too. The service plan from BMW is a joke and purely a marketing move, to make sure the targeted group of first-hand owners, will not be scared away by troubling and time consuming maintenance plans.
The parts that are similar or shared with the regular 5-series should be rather free from trouble. All special items, probably not.
 

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I sympathize with you and how your Wife feels about being able to make it to her destination in the M5.

I am in the same boat, out of 37-cars owned (Yes, we have been married that long) all but three where hand me downs once my Wife lost faith in a car.

Get AAA enjoy the M5 (it may actually be reliable now if 3-pgs of parts were replaced), let your Wife pick the next car.
 

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I feel the pain there for sure. M5 is an expensive car to maintain. This is part of the reason this club is so exclusive because it takes a real M5 lover to see it through, after spending thousands on maintenance still adore the car and drive it. Most people just toss the white flag and say they "dont have money to burn"

But for some of us, regardless of the cost, there is just no true substitute. And R8's/Labos and other V10 cars are actually more expensive to maintain.
 

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But for some of us, regardless of the cost, there is just no true substitute. And R8's/Labos and other V10 cars are actually more expensive to maintain.
And they probably NEVER see the daily miles tacked on to their v10s...
 

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And they probably NEVER see the daily miles tacked on to their v10s...
Good point, the exotics never get used for a milk run, a trip to Mexico for roll on racing is a lot easier on a car for sure, my 928 never sees a trip less than 50-miles, it has a big oil sump that takes along time to get above a temperature where vapors boil off, using it exclusively for long trips means my oil does not change color in a years worth of driving. Zero oil consumption perfect compression on a 28-year old motor owned since 1994.

Bought from the original owner a neurosurgeon who had 5-other Porsches he drove locally, he assured me the 928 was only used for long distance trips over 300-miles due to the GT comfort (rather than the loud RSR's, turbo's etc he had)
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I see your points as far as the engine. Hey, I understand, It's a tuned down F1 engine. But lets say I had a 525. I would still be upset that I needed to replace some of the smaller dumb stuff non engine related. That's all I am saying. Even the person who bought the 525 bought that over a Ford Taurus because I am sure in their mind, the BMW brand stands for a higher quality. I am sorry, some things should just last the life of a car. My Molding was $35 and my hood struts $25. I am not complaining about the price of that stuff. But the fact that BMW dealers carry tons of both of those things in stock should tell them something. Someone should say, "hey, how about we see why our customers have to keep replacing those parts" Its good to hear some of you had no issues at all. I am hoping I am done with my gremlins. There is still hope.
 
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If OEMs didn't make money on replacement parts, I would agree with you. But if you don't think they take into account replacement parts in the equation of profit potential for a car over a 20 year period, I'd call you naive. Most of the parts on the car all lasted well past the warranty phase. In the business of making money, why would you want a part to last longer than that?

I'm not saying I agree with the principal, but someone here pointed that out a year or so ago (a particular race team engineer if I recall correctly) and the more I've thought about that, the more it makes sense.
 

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My Father is a highly acclaimed professor but does not have a clue about cars.

He did buy a brand new Mercedes 220S in 1962 and brought it over by boat, I remember him letting me drive it on back roads when I was 5-years old.

This was a poorly engineered car, it was indestructible, due to large safety factors being used.

Now modern engineering with finite element based 3D CAD space non-destructive testing can hone parts to meet the bare minimum of performance requirements. Built in obsoleteness was discovered.

He had the 220S for 30-years, only changed oil when engine made noise and started smoking, it had over 300,000 miles on it, no idea if diff or gear oil ever was changed.

We lived 1,200-miles apart thus did not see him often, it was never waxed, the deep blue paint was chalk white never garaged, I used several tubs of rubbing compound and filled up a garbage bin with rags, I must have removed 10-coats of the original 18-coats of lacquer Mercedes put on their cars in those days.

Amazing that this tank of a car is so cheap to buy even today and can still be found in excellent shape.

This is what you need if you hate to maintain cars but expect 300,000 miles out of them (and can take more abuse than any car built today):

1962 Mercedes 220S For Sale denver, Colorado
 

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My parents have a Toyota Camry, it is a 96 with 450,000 miles on and still going strong kinggf

Even my Infiniti 2004 G35 had close to 200,000 miles on it when I sold it and that was in an 8 year span, never had an issue with it so there are cars out there that do last a long time with no issues but just do not have the performance of an M5.
 
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