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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, I recently opened my cluster to change the needles to red color, and when I put everything back together the RPM needle does not move. I removed the cluster cables from the back and reconnected them back again and then I worked just fine, turned the car off and on again after 10 minutes, same problem.
the battery is new

Any ideas on what I should do? It would be very helpful, thanks!
 

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The stepper motors on a E39 cluster are very delicate and so easy to destroy if the needles are not removed with the proper tool.The Rpm signal is sent through can signal to the cluster so if the connector or wiring was a issue then all your gauges would not work. I would bet you damaged/destroyed the stepper motor for the tac. All it takes is pulling up the needle/stepper motor shaft up 1 mm and they are done . Even if you press them back in they won't work properly they will stick going up and down and within a few minutes the needle will stop moving.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The stepper motors on a E39 cluster are very delicate and so easy to destroy if the needles are not removed with the proper tool.The Rpm signal is sent through can signal to the cluster so if the connector or wiring was a issue then all your gauges would not work. I would bet you damaged/destroyed the stepper motor for the tac. All it takes is pulling up the needle/stepper motor shaft up 1 mm and they are done . Even if you press them back in they won't work properly they will stick going up and down and within a few minutes the needle will stop moving.
Hi. Thanks for the answer, i opened my cluster yesterday to find out that the motor is broken as you said. It does not go back to place, i hope not the other motors are broken but they seem fine.

I acually have another cluster as parts and the motor is not broken on it.
Do you possibly know if it is easy to change the motor? Does it need to be programmed some way after the installation?
I do not want to pay couple of hundred dollars to get it fixed. At least i will try to fix it my own first if possible.
 

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Hi. Thanks for the answer, i opened my cluster yesterday to find out that the motor is broken as you said. It does not go back to place, i hope not the other motors are broken but they seem fine.

I acually have another cluster as parts and the motor is not broken on it.
Do you possibly know if it is easy to change the motor? Does it need to be programmed some way after the installation?
I do not want to pay couple of hundred dollars to get it fixed. At least i will try to fix it my own first if possible.
Check this out because I think this might be your issue. The tach needles when you installed it it should come to rest at the little stop at 0 . Check to see it the needle is behind the stop .and if it is there is no reason to remove it just pull or bent up the tip on the needle and move it over the stop.
 

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Hi. Thanks for the answer, i opened my cluster yesterday to find out that the motor is broken as you said. It does not go back to place, i hope not the other motors are broken but they seem fine.

I acually have another cluster as parts and the motor is not broken on it.
Do you possibly know if it is easy to change the motor? Does it need to be programmed some way after the installation?
I do not want to pay couple of hundred dollars to get it fixed. At least i will try to fix it my own first if possible.
If that is not the issue then.
The stepper motor can still look good but trust me all it takes is for the shaft to be pulled up 1-2 mm and you can press it back in and think they are okay but the stepper motor is damaged. The stepper motor might work but it will be very erratic and eventually stop working.. To remove them properly you need to hold the steeper motor shaft from behind the face plate very tight and twist off the needles from the front of the face plate.. When your doing this you have to make sure the shaft does not turn and you are not allowing the shaft to be pulled out with the needle as you are twisting them off To do this the best way is to grab a good quality pair of needle nose pliers and grind down about a inch of the tip to about 2-3 mm thick .But you have to be careful because where you holding the needle shaft from behind you have a clock spring on the motors that can very easily be damaged if the pliers go side ways while removing the needles. No the cluster will not have to be programmed if you are just removing it to change the motors . Removing the motors off the board is easy if done properly .To remove them you take off the 2 torx screws and you will see the 4 prongs ,2 on each side of the motor you use a pair of pliers to grab each prong and push them through the board from front to back. Do not take off the screw and just try to pull the motors out from the back ,you will destroy them. Putting the motors back in is easy just line up the prongs and use the screw to drive them back in. Make sure you mark the top of each motor so you install them the same way because the will bolt in upside down if your not paying attention. Did you mark all you needles before removing them so all the gauges are accurate when you reinstalled them?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
If that is not the issue then.
The stepper motor can still look good but trust me all it takes is for the shaft to be pulled up 1-2 mm and you can press it back in and think they are okay but the stepper motor is damaged. The stepper motor might work but it will be very erratic and eventually stop working.. To remove them properly you need to hold the steeper motor shaft from behind the face plate very tight and twist off the needles from the front of the face plate.. When your doing this you have to make sure the shaft does not turn and you are not allowing the shaft to be pulled out with the needle as you are twisting them off To do this the best way is to grab a good quality pair of needle nose pliers and grind down about a inch of the tip to about 2-3 mm thick .But you have to be careful because where you holding the needle shaft from behind you have a clock spring on the motors that can very easily be damaged if the pliers go side ways while removing the needles. No the cluster will not have to be programmed if you are just removing it to change the motors . Removing the motors off the board is easy if done properly .To remove them you take off the 2 torx screws and you will see the 4 prongs ,2 on each side of the motor you use a pair of pliers to grab each prong and push them through the board from front to back. Do not take off the screw and just try to pull the motors out from the back ,you will destroy them. Putting the motors back in is easy just line up the prongs and use the screw to drive them back in. Make sure you mark the top of each motor so you install them the same way because the will bolt in upside down if your not paying attention. Did you mark all you needles before removing them so all the gauges are accurate when you reinstalled them?
I did not remove them, i typed wrong. I acually was coloring the needles red so there was definetly a movment. I have tested the other needle using pa soft 1.4.0 and they seem fine. I guess i need to change the motor out with the other one i have. The only thing is that i am nervous about removing the needles because they can be broken easily.

Quick question, when i install the new motor, does the shaft need to be at 0 when removed from the part cluster? Or can it be for example at 2000rpm and removed and then i would just let it go back to it's place when installed to the new cluster?
 

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That is weird because if you didn't remove the needles and only colored them then there is no way you could of damaged the stepper motor unless you pulled up kinda hard on the tac needle . Pushing on the needles or moving them like from 0 to 7000 rpm with your finger will not damage anything either . So when you took the cluster out again to check it can you move the tac needle with your finger from 0 to max rpm and does it go back to 0 by itself ? When i remove the needles I actually turn them to say 2000-4000 rpm then hold the shaft with the pliers and and take off the needles ,the motors go back to rest or 0 .by itself yes / Then you have the mpg gauge under the tac that is a different style stepper motor where you should use the proper tool to remove needle but most times you can remove it with no issues using say a salad fork,just pry up . That one is not like the other gauges where you need to hold the shaft to remove needle . Where are you located because if you need help and you like I can fix it up for you? Btw I am in Edmonton Canada
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
That is weird because if you didn't remove the needles and only colored them then there is no way you could of damaged the stepper motor unless you pulled up kinda hard on the tac needle . Pushing on the needles or moving them like from 0 to 7000 rpm with your finger will not damage anything either . So when you took the cluster out again to check it can you move the tac needle with your finger from 0 to max rpm and does it go back to 0 by itself ? When i remove the needles I actually turn them to say 2000-4000 rpm then hold the shaft with the pliers and and take off the needles ,the motors go back to rest or 0 .by itself yes / Then you have the mpg gauge under the tac that is a different style stepper motor where you should use the proper tool to remove needle but most times you can remove it with no issues using say a salad fork,just pry up . That one is not like the other gauges where you need to hold the shaft to remove needle . Where are you located because if you need help and you like I can fix it up for you? Btw I am in Edmonton Canada
I am located in sweden so that is a long distance hah...
When i opened it again i looked at it from the top and i noticed that the RPM needle was kind of loose. There was a bigger gap from the shaft and the needle from the others. So wothout thinking i pushed it in and AFTER i pushed it in i moved the needle to 4000 rpm and it goes down fine but before it reaches the bottom it stops. And if i move it up again the same thing happens, it falls and then stops from nowhere.

I don't know if it broke because i pushed it but i don't think so because it did not move properly before i opened it the second time. And when i tested the cluster with pa soft the RPM was sort of lagging
 

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I am located in sweden so that is a long distance hah...
When i opened it again i looked at it from the top and i noticed that the RPM needle was kind of loose. There was a bigger gap from the shaft and the needle from the others. So wothout thinking i pushed it in and AFTER i pushed it in i moved the needle to 4000 rpm and it goes down fine but before it reaches the bottom it stops. And if i move it up again the same thing happens, it falls and then stops from nowhere.

I don't know if it broke because i pushed it but i don't think so because it did not move properly before i opened it the second time. And when i tested the cluster with pa soft the RPM was sort of lagging
Ya if the motor is lagging or sticking that stepper motor is gone . I think that cluster was taken apart before for pixel repairs and the stepper motor was damaged then. Trust me I have seen clusters repaired by the ''pros'' that have had all the stepper motors damaged and stuff crazy glued back together and gauges way off spec They work but the needles will be lazy and stick . What year and model is the E39 and it is a high cluster 2 button right? Sweden speedometers are in kph?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Ya if the motor is lagging or sticking that stepper motor is gone . I think that cluster was taken apart before for pixel repairs and the stepper motor was damaged then. Trust me I have seen clusters repaired by the ''pros'' that have had all the stepper motors damaged and stuff crazy glued back together and gauges way off spec They work but the needles will be lazy and stick . What year and model is the E39 and it is a high cluster 2 button right? Sweden speedometers are in kph?
Yes, i am unlucky and i guess i have to risk it and do it by myself then...

It is a 2003 530i with high cluster and it is in kph
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Yes, i am unlucky and i guess i have to risk it and do it by myself then...

It is a 2003 530i with high cluster and it is in kph
Ya if the motor is lagging or sticking that stepper motor is gone . I think that cluster was taken apart before for pixel repairs and the stepper motor was damaged then. Trust me I have seen clusters repaired by the ''pros'' that have had all the stepper motors damaged and stuff crazy glued back together and gauges way off spec They work but the needles will be lazy and stick . What year and model is the E39 and it is a high cluster 2 button right? Sweden speedometers are in kph?
The thing is i have litterally searched all google about this cluster for sale. It would be easier to buy a new one. But the problem is there is really not even ONE cluster on the internet with the same code, and i dont know if both BMW and VDO codes have to match for it to be plug and play. I really wish there was a cluster with the same code
 

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The thing is i have litterally searched all google about this cluster for sale. It would be easier to buy a new one. But the problem is there is really not even ONE cluster on the internet with the same code, and i dont know if both BMW and
The thing is i have litterally searched all google about this cluster for sale. It would be easier to buy a new one. But the problem is there is really not even ONE cluster on the internet with the same code, and i dont know if both BMW and VDO codes have to match for it to be plug and play. I really wish there was a cluster with the same code
VDO codes have to match for it to be plug and play. I really wish there was a cluster with the same code
The cluster code aka Hw and sw don't really mater because even if you bolt in a cluster with the same hw and sw the mileage will still be mismatched and the cluster will still need to be coded with the proper vin and cars options coded to the cluster with ncs expert. The vin can be written with pa soft but the only way for the new cluster to display the cars correct mileage the epprom area that holds the mileage has to be erased/set to zero and the only way to do that is to remove the epprom off the board and use the proper tool and of course the needles have to come off to do this.Once the cluster is virginized and mileage set to zero then you bolt it into the car and write the cars vin with pa soft to the cluster and the cluster will automatically download your cars correct mileage from the light control module as soon as your turn on the ignition because the vin in the lcm and cluster will match. True mileage in a E39 is stored in the cluster the light control module and ews and keys. So the Hw and sw don't really matter because you can bolt in any hw/sw cluster and as long as the cluster is virginized /mileage set to 0 then you code it to the car .with pa soft and ncs expert. so any hw/sw cluster will work This car is it your only means of transportation? Because if your in a jam and need help you can send me your cluster and I will fix it up properly and I won't charge you a dime for parts or labor just pay shipping both ways. I sent a rebuilt E39 M5 cluster to Sweden about a year ago and it cost about $75 shipping Canadian one way if I remember correct and it took 7 days to get there What is the part number on the back of your cluster
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
The cluster code aka Hw and sw don't really mater because even if you bolt in a cluster with the same hw and sw the mileage will still be mismatched and the cluster will still need to be coded with the proper vin and cars options coded to the cluster with ncs expert. The vin can be written with pa soft but the only way for the new cluster to display the cars correct mileage the epprom area that holds the mileage has to be erased/set to zero and the only way to do that is to remove the epprom off the board and use the proper tool and of course the needles have to come off to do this.Once the cluster is virginized and mileage set to zero then you bolt it into the car and write the cars vin with pa soft to the cluster and the cluster will automatically download your cars correct mileage from the light control module as soon as your turn on the ignition because the vin in the lcm and cluster will match. True mileage in a E39 is stored in the cluster the light control module and ews and keys. So the Hw and sw don't really matter because you can bolt in any hw/sw cluster and as long as the cluster is virginized /mileage set to 0 then you code it to the car .with pa soft and ncs expert. so any hw/sw cluster will work This car is it your only means of transportation? Because if your in a jam and need help you can send me your cluster and I will fix it up properly and I won't charge you a dime for parts or labor just pay shipping both ways. I sent a rebuilt E39 M5 cluster to Sweden about a year ago and it cost about $75 shipping Canadian one way if I remember correct and it took 7 days to get there What is the part number on the back of your cluster
Thank you that is really nice of you to offer me help. I looked it out and it costs about $20 to ship to you.
Getting a new cluster and changing the milage would be a headache, so i guess it would be better to change the needle. And i think you are right that the other owner had opened the cluster for pixel repair and broke the needle because even the gas needle doesn't go back to 0. Do you have instagram or something i can contact you on so i could send you more info about the cluster and more?
 

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Thank you that is really nice of you to offer me help. I looked it out and it costs about $20 to ship to you.
Getting a new cluster and changing the milage would be a headache, so i guess it would be better to change the needle. And i think you are right that the other owner had opened the cluster for pixel repair and broke the needle because even the gas needle doesn't go back to 0. Do you have instagram or something i can contact you on so i could send you more info about the cluster and more?
Ya I bet all the motors are damaged ,no worries I got lots of good stepper motors on hand.
Contact me through email and I will give you all my info
[email protected]
 
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