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I am inclined to agree with you except that if the drain is restricted which is in the exhaust noid the flow out of the outlet of the intake may complicate the exhaust outlet leaving the intake outlet still mainly working. It would also depend on the movement of the intake valves which appears to be much less adjustment than the exhaust. Since your tests have been done at idle the intake does not move but the exhaust moves a lot.

The drawing can be a bit confusing because he added the hole that is drilled to drill another hole then plugged. It is important to have that because at one end of the hole it looks like a hole but no pressure will flow thru because it is plugged on purpose.
In this pic the Finer/neater arrow points to the drain hole that is last in the system and the circled hole is the one that joins the two ports. I believe this pic is oriented as bank two. Did it a very long time ago.
Blast the fine arrow hole first then go back and check "this hole". Then move outward and check the holes from the pistons to the noids. I think I would be inclined to put a pipe cleaner thru as a second check or wire if you cant find a small enough pipe cleaner. They are all straight so something should go thru them easily.

Although I am a bit skeptical it would be foolish not to directly test it now that it has been identified.The second pic is bank 2 and the last is bank one just so you can orient yourself to find the hole location.
vanos19-crop1this hole.jpg

VANOS Top View complete Bank 5-8.JPG

VANOS Front View Bank 1-4.JPG
 

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Did you blow air through the outlet port in the timing cover? Maybe take off the oil cap and put tissue over the opening, see if it is clear.
 

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As I said I think this maybe a new problem because everything has been ruled out. I am not sure how we could have ruled everything out and there is still a problem. The signal is still up in the air but things moved when you switched the plugs to the wrong banks, but not really maybe. It is confusing for me to look at WDS and switch the plugs but I think electrically that the exhaust become intakes and since INPA only reports exhaust position you never got to see if the problem cam moved nor did you see if the electrics worked. Only because there is no way to see in INPA.

I think you are stuck switching the units side for side including the spline gears. That is not the only step because there have been a few where the splines were not sliding so after you switch units if the code moves the splines would need to be switched back to see if the code moved again.

Have you tried unplugging bank two noids starting the car and reading the voltage output?
 

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Discussion Starter #86
I have a code reader that can tell me the position of the intake and exhaust cams.

I tried unplugging both bank noids and reading and it showed nothing , probably because the meter is just a cheap AVO



Going back to the cps , could it be the cps although when i switched the connector for the banks the exhaust on both side showed 60 degrees , i believe that confirms that the cps is reading
 

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Discussion Starter #87
Also , could it be the vanos pressure regulator?
I was reading through some of 68FB old posts and he mentioned that if the hose that connects to the bank 1 upper timing cover is pouring oil at idle the regulator is stuck or something.

When i disconnected the hose , oil poured out.

But if that would be the case then i dont seem why it only effects the bank 1 exhaust
 

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Don't think CPS could do that although that is what is saying the cam is not moving.

That is right, just realized I got something wrong thinking about switching the plugs the exhaust physically move and that could be read.
 

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Can you not get DIS to work? This could give extremely important info!

Pressure regulator problem causes oil in the plenum and should give you error codes for both banks if it was going to throw codes.

When you switch boards, the noids flip, intakes become exhaust and vice versa.
If you switch boards and code stays exactly the same it is not the noid itself (except in the unlikely case that the corresponding intake noid of the other board was bad).
So that leaves either a unit problem like piston not moving, gears stuck, a wiring problem, or the DME itself.

Didn't you already replace CPS?
 

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Discussion Starter #90
No for some reason i can't get DIS working
And yes already replaced cps


My theory is that maybe the exhaust piston needs a little bit more pressure to move then the others. When i was retarding the timing to change the spring plates it took alot more force and wiggeling to retard the exhaust cam then the intake.

So let's say the regulator is leaking and not regulating 100 bars , maybe let's say it's at 70 bar , which is enough to move all the cams except the exhaust one

Anyway that's my theory , maybe it makes no sense at all lol
 

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Discussion Starter #91
If i flip the bank 1 board "upside down" and connect it and start the car , both exhaust and inlet cams go to 60ish degrees.


Still haven't checked or tried anything with the pressure regulator
 

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Trying to figure out what is happening when you switched the plugs side for side and this upside down test was frying my brain, but really it is simple and I think gives the answer, but then hides it again. What happens in both cases is inlet valves become outlet valves and intake become exhaust.
What we are seeing is the car opening both outlets but maybe not operating the inlets because of the gross error in the valves. This is purely a guess maybe a bit educated from seeing how BMW has handled emergencies in other parts of the car.
It would try and open the exhaust inlet and outlet but the intake valve would move so it would correct for that and ultimately would decide things are screwed and try and set the valves to the safe position which is the smallest overlap which would be inlets off and outlets open. I suspect this is safety mode.

So that leads me to believe you have an hydraulic issue. Like you suggested not enough oil pressure to move your sticky cam. Maybe the sticky cam is just too sticky for normal pressure. Checking the pressure to the solenoids would be one important test. The other thing it could still be is that your solenoids are in fact leaking still. Some do not seal just because you cleaned them and maybe you have the same solenoid on both boards that leaks. If a solenoid leaks on the inlet the car can easily compensate by opening the the outlet so you see no error. But if you have a leaking outlet then maybe the range of adjustment will over come the ability to compensate for that leak. Depends on the software which we have no idea about.

That leads me to testing the solenoids for leaks. A simple way might be to just switch two noids on the cam in question. No more than that to keep it simple. It is pretty simple to just un-solder two noids and resolder them in the other place. As I recall you may have done that, but you seem to do several things at the same time which might have skewed your results. Might be they are one at a time and you just report in groups. If you are not positive you did only that at the time you did it, I would do it again. Tests should only have one change and one test at a time.
It is not much more to buy the high pressure gauge and some hose and a "T" to test the overall pressure and at the same time I think I would re route the drain to a catch can to see how much oil is being drained.

Ultimately I think it is your sticky cam, which makes perfect sense.
 

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Discussion Starter #95
I'll try switching the solenoids on the boards

And i'll make a pressure gauge adapter

Have much should the exhaust stuck cam at around 4 degrees sacrifice performance? Car pretty good
 

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Yes things will happen. If the valves are not where they should be the wrong amount of exhaust gas will be returned. That side will be lean so the trims will elevate and the car will have a funny transition where it turns the exhaust gas back down because the trims will be too high. Can the car compensate? Maybe hard to say but you will not likely be causing any damage although you might have a B2 code in your future because at the transition zone the car will be rich.

It is possible driving it could be the best thing to do. Maybe activity will loosen up that sticky cam.
 

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Discussion Starter #97
Just switched the vanos solenoids on the boards , same thing still the cam seems to be at 3-6 degrees

I'm i losing any horsepower because of this?
 

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Yes you will produce less torque. You will produce less torque in the range where the exhaust gas is returned to the cylinder. Many lower rpm range.
 

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Have you ever resolved the issue? If so what was it?

I have a freshly built engine and got keys then 80 miles on it and I keep getting b9 code.

We have switched cps sides... switched solenoid board sides.... tested continuity... checked timing.... seen that solenoids are popping out just like yours did...

Looking st next replacing the vanos unit....

Peter has been helping out and so has my mechanic who did the install... were all a little lost and what the issue could be other than possibly a faulty vanos unit....

So I'm curious did you ever resolve your issue?
 
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