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Discussion Starter #1
I messaged west coast riots about having our throttle bodies done and of course they were reluctant to jump on board but I assured them that it'd be worth it with the interest on the forums would be worth it. I got a response e-mail from one of the guys and I hope I can get an alternative to dinan out there for those of us who want the extra air but would rather not spend the dinan price tag.

For those of you who have never heard of them before, they make larger diameter throttle bodies for the E36 M3, and have exceeded the dimensions of the dinan unit for less money as well. I'm going to put one on my M3 when I get a chance and hopefully we can get some throttle body alternatives out there for the M5!!!!

Anyone interested please post your thoughts and I will forward the link to westcoastriots


Matt,

What city are you located in? Can you leave me a phone number and contact time I can reach you? Let me do some investigation work.

Let me give you a brief over view of what it would take to develop the m5 throttle body setup.

First, the individual throttle bodies must be removed from their setup. If they can’t be separated, there is no physical way of machining the throttle bodies. A different machine can be used, but that would be extremely inaccurate and could cause other problems down the road.

Assuming we can do the boring work, the throttle plates will have to be custom machined at approx 40mm diameter, this would increase machine time. Then there is reassembly time. Assuming we could resync in house, that would require extra time.

Then, with so much more air a software upgrade is almost guaranteed. We do not provide software so Dinan is likely the only other option, or maybe custom burned.

If it is physically possible, I will do some R&D and give an estimated price quote. I would need a few order up front to make up the cost. I will also need to find a set of individual throttle bodies as a core unit ($$$$).

I hate to hear that any Riot Racing supporter is “deeply saddened” so, I’ll give up some hours of sleep to find out what the deal is on the throttle bodies.

 

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what does he mean 'separating the throttle bodies from their set up"?

he mentions 40mm, the stock tb's are larger than that, i thought 48mm stock, and dinan bores them to either 50 or 52mm.

Would they also make the larger diameter velocity stacks? No reason to put bigger tb's on if you're going thru smaller velocity stacks, and nobody else currently makes larger velocity stacks besides dinan.

I'm pretty sure the tb's need to be sync'd on the car, so unless they are doing the installation, that isn't an issue for the machine shop.

Someone on this board (97m3turbo, or something like that) did have a shop bore out his throttle bodies (a spare set he had), but then the problem was getting larger velocity stacks. He also went a little too large, iirc, and was concerned about drivability issues.

Personally, i don't see a real reason to reinvent the wheel when a proven product already exists, once you get the tb's done, the throttle plates, find someone to make velocity stacks (copy dinan, i suppose), and tune the software, I wonder how much money you'll really save.
 
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Discussion Starter #3
There are several companies that make larger velocity stacks, I've had a set sitting under my bed for 6 months from eurobahn, technik also has their velocity stacks and you can get them from beastpower.
 

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There are several companies that make larger velocity stacks, I've had a set sitting under my bed for 6 months from eurobahn, technik also has their velocity stacks and you can get them from beastpower.

You will also need the throttle body synchronization tool which most BMW dealerships have but since it is very expensive most independent shops do not have one. This may be a big hang up because most BMW dealers wont help you out to wash their hands of some unknown to work part. If you do not have this your car will never ever run right.
 

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There are several companies that make larger velocity stacks, I've had a set sitting under my bed for 6 months from eurobahn, technik also has their velocity stacks and you can get them from beastpower.
I have a set, but they are "shorties" so we probably give up some low end power. I keep meaning to try them out, but not high on my list of things to do in my "spare" time.

Of course, with bigger tb's, the shorties may work fine. I am sure someone like PC could fine tune the software, I am not too worried about that. Just do some dyno runs and send them the data if they already don't have something in house. Shadowman did a custom tune, so it is doable.

I think the bigger issue is getting a good indy to synch up the new tb's. I believe that is an on the car adjustment and probably needs some special tools.

I am friends with one of the guys who works for the new local Dinan authorized distributor locally, next time I see him I will ask about tb's synchronization.

Regards,
Jerry
 

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I think the bigger issue is getting a good indy to synch up the new tb's. I believe that is an on the car adjustment and probably needs some special tools.

I am friends with one of the guys who works for the new local Dinan authorized distributor locally, next time I see him I will ask about tb's synchronization.

Regards,
Jerry

Hey I was thinking the same thing :cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter #7
The shop seems willing to give it a try so any info the board can contribute to help get a quality product out there will be much appreciated and gsfent, Mfiveleo has a custom plenum spacer in the works that will probably help your stacks get the air they need.
 

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There are several companies that make larger velocity stacks, I've had a set sitting under my bed for 6 months from eurobahn, technik also has their velocity stacks and you can get them from beastpower.
and the aftermarket velocity stacks are larger diameter, i.e. they will match up with what ever the machine shop decides will be the best diameter for a tuned S62?
 

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The shop seems willing to give it a try so any info the board can contribute to help get a quality product out there will be much appreciated and gsfent, Mfiveleo has a custom plenum spacer in the works that will probably help your stacks get the air they need.
OK, that would be an incentive to get the stacks out of the back of the garage!!! Tell him to get cracking!!:7::7:

Would definitely need to get some dyno pulls to see how they run (at least on the dyno). If he puts it together, I will send the dyno runs to PC to see if they can run the software changes for others.
Regards,
Jerry
 

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Discussion Starter #10
I'm going to give them my car and my after market velocity stacks to do whatever they need to, to make this thing work. If a different design is needed I'll see if I can have some custom made to go with the throttle bodies
 

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FWIW, I think the main reason that the Dinan throttle bodies work SO WELL is that coupled with the enlarged diameter they designed the perfect length stack to go on top of it to resonate properly within the desired rpm range. Remember that you'll have to open up the stack diameter too, so going to a larger dia throttle body plus a short stack is not going to yield a result anything like Dinan. You'll end up with a combo that will maybe work great at 6500rpm (or even a higher rpm if you're not careful with the overall length from stack opening to inlet valve once you open up the diameter), but the whole mid-range might actually be losing power, perhaps by more than you can imagine. To come close to what Dinan achieved, you'll need to essentially copy their velocity stacks too -- these two coupled together in the overall design are critical.
 
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Anything new happen with this?
Does anyone know the size of the E36 M3 throttle plates?
 

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if it's anything like the custom headers, it'll probably be a while.
 

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I heard that in South Africa they porte the stock TB's and use E36 M3 plates. Does any member in SA know about this. I belive Chip Logic in SA does this work.
 

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bump. looking for SA members
 

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Just FYI, I went form a full S-2 to a 100% stock S-2 with headers (coming off as soon as possible) and the stage 5 SW. The car runs perfect. No sync or alignment of the TB's were needed and like stated everything runs perfect, no SES or problems anywhere in the RPM band.

My point... Get the car dynoed with air fuels, buy the throttle bodies and install them. Re-dyno the car with air fuels and then and only then make a tuning/ sync or velocity stack assessment.

Ryan
 

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My point... Get the car dynoed with air fuels, buy the throttle bodies and install them. Re-dyno the car with air fuels and then and only then make a tuning/ sync or velocity stack assessment.

Ryan
Ryan, what exactly do you mean by dyno with air fuels?
Thanks
 

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I think he was refering to have the dyno results with a air/fuel mixture reading.

Did anyone catch the set of throttlebodies and heads on ebay? they went for $500.00. Then there was a S62 long block with bore damage that just sold for $1500.00.
 
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