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Lots of great comments on my other post on comparing the Cadillac CTS-V to keeping my 02 M5. THANK You! :M5thumbs:

While I was at the BMW dealer asking about extending the maintainance contract there was a gorgeous 760i in the showroom about 6 ft away. I guess the salesman saw me admiring it and before I knew it we were out in a 745i for a testdrive.

First off, this in not an M5 by any stretch. It is definitely a luxury car but on a different plane than say the Merc, Lexus LS430 or the Jag. You can really feel connected when driving the 745. The quality and attention to detail is definitely there, especially comparing the fit and finish to the recent Cadillacs I drove. Not as much of a visceral feeling as the M5. It has an incredible ride with load leving around the corners preventing all body roll up to about .5 Gs. The voice command worked well. The iDrive which I was hesitant about actually wasn't bad. You would use it to set preferences, many of which we in our M5s have now to go to the dealer. Styling is attractive to me, It's different from almost everything else which is a plus for me. I, however dislike the new 5 series styling, too much of a Japanaese flavor for my taste.

All in all, I could see going for the 7 now and re-evaluating an M5 decision in 2-3 years when everything gets sorted out, and the dealer markups are over and ther first year or two glitches get ironed out.

What Say You? :typing:
 

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Sounds like a cool plan, you may want to think about going for the 545 though. It seems as though you have no problem with the 7 styling and the idrive so naturally one would question why not the 545? You can get a stickshift in it where as the 745 you cannot. Might be something else to think about. I guess you could always SC the 545 and have an S5 :)

Anyways good luck on the choice :)

Johnny D said:
Lots of great comments on my other post on comparing the Cadillac CTS-V to keeping my 02 M5. THANK You! :M5thumbs:

While I was at the BMW dealer asking about extending the maintainance contract there was a gorgeous 760i in the showroom about 6 ft away. I guess the salesman saw me admiring it and before I knew it we were out in a 745i for a testdrive.

First off, this in not an M5 by any stretch. It is definitely a luxury car but on a different plane than say the Merc, Lexus LS430 or the Jag. You can really feel connected when driving the 745. The quality and attention to detail is definitely there, especially comparing the fit and finish to the recent Cadillacs I drove. Not as much of a visceral feeling as the M5. It has an incredible ride with load leving around the corners preventing all body roll up to about .5 Gs. The voice command worked well. The iDrive which I was hesitant about actually wasn't bad. You would use it to set preferences, many of which we in our M5s have now to go to the dealer. Styling is attractive to me, It's different from almost everything else which is a plus for me. I, however dislike the new 5 series styling, too much of a Japanaese flavor for my taste.

All in all, I could see going for the 7 now and re-evaluating an M5 decision in 2-3 years when everything gets sorted out, and the dealer markups are over and ther first year or two glitches get ironed out.

What Say You? :typing:
 

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i agree with flynhawaiian as the new 7 series facelift is due very soon, you wouldn't want to increase the rate of depreciation by buying the "old shape." I personally think the 7 series is a better car having owned a 740, the 745 would be a great purchase, they really are the ultimate cruising limo.

or if your a diesel fan... (appologies for my bad language ouich ) the 735d will also be out very soon.

:cheers: <SCRIPT type=text/javascript> vbmenu_register("postmenu_473520", true); </SCRIPT>
 

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As nice as the new 3.d twin turbo engine is, we cannot get it across the pond :(

richhaywood said:
i agree with flynhawaiian as the new 7 series facelift is due very soon, you wouldn't want to increase the rate of depreciation by buying the "old shape." I personally think the 7 series is a better car having owned a 740, the 745 would be a great purchase, they really are the ultimate cruising limo.

or if your a diesel fan... (appologies for my bad language ouich ) the 735d will also be out very soon.

:cheers: <SCRIPT type=text/javascript> vbmenu_register("postmenu_473520", true); </SCRIPT>
 

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If you are buying pre-owned, make sure you get extended warranty covering all of electronics! The current 7-series have so much unexplainable software problems since '02, that BMW NA did a lot of buy backs (read: cover-ups and prevent a "lemon" law disaster). '02 owners are upgraded to '03, '03 to '04. Last I understood even the latest software didn't fix many of the weird problems that continued to surface. Everytime I was at my local BMW dealer talking to service personnel, all they could do you shake their collective heads and sigh.

I was going to buy a 745Li for my wife - fully loaded with warranty. At the end we decided not to take the risk, plus we still love the style and handsomeness of the 2001 740i. Apparently many people do feel the same way, as the value of late E38s held up well (in California), while the E65 plunged in value and in new sales.

If you want additional opinion, talk to service personnel casually on your next visit, or visit competitor forums to hear their side of the rumors (e.g., Lexus forums).

Hopefully the upcoming face-lifted model will have the problems worked out - for good. For one thing, I would not hire BMW engineers, QA, or management, to build airplane avionics software! :7:
 

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Johnny D said:
Lots of great comments on my other post on comparing the Cadillac CTS-V to keeping my 02 M5. THANK You! :M5thumbs:

While I was at the BMW dealer asking about extending the maintainance contract there was a gorgeous 760i in the showroom about 6 ft away. I guess the salesman saw me admiring it and before I knew it we were out in a 745i for a testdrive.

First off, this in not an M5 by any stretch. It is definitely a luxury car but on a different plane than say the Merc, Lexus LS430 or the Jag. You can really feel connected when driving the 745. The quality and attention to detail is definitely there, especially comparing the fit and finish to the recent Cadillacs I drove. Not as much of a visceral feeling as the M5. It has an incredible ride with load leving around the corners preventing all body roll up to about .5 Gs. The voice command worked well. The iDrive which I was hesitant about actually wasn't bad. You would use it to set preferences, many of which we in our M5s have now to go to the dealer. Styling is attractive to me, It's different from almost everything else which is a plus for me. I, however dislike the new 5 series styling, too much of a Japanaese flavor for my taste.

All in all, I could see going for the 7 now and re-evaluating an M5 decision in 2-3 years when everything gets sorted out, and the dealer markups are over and ther first year or two glitches get ironed out.

What Say You? :typing:
I just got a 2003 745i with sport package, conveniance package, logic7 sound system and security glass. Also 100k mile factory warranty and 100k mile maintenance. It was a factory buyback car that has been updated with the latest "bug-free" software. For a limited time, BMW was offering 0% interest on these cars. :cool2: This is my evaluation.

The steering precision is much better than the M5, more closer to my E46, and the body roll is flat until you reach the outer limits. And those limits seem high. No noticable understeer like that in the M5. (like the E60 M5, the 745 does not use Active Steering) I have made the car lean to the point of slighty breaking loose during a fast freeway sweeper. The car stayed poised, controlled and neutral. I am very impressed by the way the car functions on the twisties. The chassis dynamics are more settled and the braking stronger than the M5. The car is deceptively fast, probably because it is so smooth. On more than one occasion I found myself going faster than anticipated into a corner and had to really clamp on the binders. The car seems to adjust itself to your driving style. Uncanny.

The motor is smooth and strong. Of course not as strong as the M5. The transmission adapts to your driving in the "S" mode. Shifting manually using the buttons on the steering wheel is a little more engaging, but does not take the place of the experiance of the M5s 6 speed. (good thing I kept my 330i ZHP)

The iDrive is easy. It took about 10 minutes or so to figure the whole thing out without the manual and is very easy to operate when driving. Not sure why it is picked on by the press. Voice comand for the radio, CD players, navigation system and notepad makes it even simpler.

The Logic7 sound system is phenominal. 13 speakers including a center channel in the dash and 2 subs; one under each front seat. I am sure it would cost huge bucks to replicate an aftermarket system that sounds as good as this.

There are an abundance of safety features which apparently makes it one of the, if not the, safest car on the road.

If the steering and chassis dynamics and overall refinement of the 745i, is the shape of things to come in the E60 M5, then we will all be impressed when the M5 hits our shores. :typing:
 

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SandBeast said:
If you are buying pre-owned, make sure you get extended warranty covering all of electronics! The current 7-series have so much unexplainable software problems since '02, that BMW NA did a lot of buy backs (read: cover-ups and prevent a "lemon" law disaster). '02 owners are upgraded to '03, '03 to '04. Last I understood even the latest software didn't fix many of the weird problems that continued to surface. Everytime I was at my local BMW dealer talking to service personnel, all they could do you shake their collective heads and sigh.

I was going to buy a 745Li for my wife - fully loaded with warranty. At the end we decided not to take the risk, plus we still love the style and handsomeness of the 2001 740i. Apparently many people do feel the same way, as the value of late E38s held up well (in California), while the E65 plunged in value and in new sales.

If you want additional opinion, talk to service personnel casually on your next visit, or visit competitor forums to hear their side of the rumors (e.g., Lexus forums).

Hopefully the upcoming face-lifted model will have the problems worked out - for good. For one thing, I would not hire BMW engineers, QA, or management, to build airplane avionics software! :7:
All the 7 series come with a 100k mile factory warranty because of the previous problems. Before getting the 745i, I talked to a couple of the SAs and they said the latest software has taken care of the problems they had seen in the past. My car was taken back to BMW by the previous owner for stalling and naviation issues . The car was updated to the 2004 software. So far no problems have surfaced. :M5launch:
 

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Discussion Starter #8
richhaywood said:
i agree with flynhawaiian as the new 7 series facelift is due very soon, you wouldn't want to increase the rate of depreciation by buying the "old shape." I personally think the 7 series is a better car having owned a 740, the 745 would be a great purchase, they really are the ultimate cruising limo.
Haven't seen any definitive pictures yet but I tend to agree withyou both. The dealer estimates that they would see them about May, 2005.I could order it late January.

Chuckc said:
I just got a 2003 745i with sport package, conveniance package, logic7 sound system and security glass. Also 100k mile factory warranty and 100k mile maintenance. It was a factory buyback car that has been updated with the latest "bug-free" software. For a limited time, BMW was offering 0% interest on these cars. :cool2: This is my evaluation.

The steering precision is much better than the M5, more closer to my E46, and the body roll is flat until you reach the outer limits. And those limits seem high. No noticable understeer like that in the M5. (like the E60 M5, the 745 does not use Active Steering) I have made the car lean to the point of slighty breaking loose during a fast freeway sweeper. The car stayed poised, controlled and neutral. I am very impressed by the way the car functions on the twisties. The chassis dynamics are more settled and the braking stronger than the M5. The car is deceptively fast, probably because it is so smooth. On more than one occasion I found myself going faster than anticipated into a corner and had to really clamp on the binders. The car seems to adjust itself to your driving style. Uncanny.

The motor is smooth and strong. Of course not as strong as the M5. The transmission adapts to your driving in the "S" mode. Shifting manually using the buttons on the steering wheel is a little more engaging, but does not take the place of the experiance of the M5s 6 speed. (good thing I kept my 330i ZHP)

The iDrive is easy. It took about 10 minutes or so to figure the whole thing out without the manual and is very easy to operate when driving. Not sure why it is picked on by the press. Voice comand for the radio, CD players, navigation system and notepad makes it even simpler.

The Logic7 sound system is phenominal. 13 speakers including a center channel in the dash and 2 subs; one under each front seat. I am sure it would cost huge bucks to replicate an aftermarket system that sounds as good as this.

There are an abundance of safety features which apparently makes it one of the, if not the, safest car on the road.

If the steering and chassis dynamics and overall refinement of the 745i, is the shape of things to come in the E60 M5, then we will all be impressed when the M5 hits our shores. :typing:
Great review, Thanks, I was thinking about all of those items.

What is your thoughts on the Slate Green color with grey interior? I wanted to do something different than the Grey or silver exterior and the dark colors are too hard to maintain. Any feedback on the green?? :confused:
 

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Johnny D said:
Great review, Thanks, I was thinking about all of those items.

What is your thoughts on the Slate Green color with grey interior? I wanted to do something different than the Grey or silver exterior and the dark colors are too hard to maintain. Any feedback on the green?? :confused:
A slate green 745Li with BBS wheels was the first one to catch my eye on the lot. If I was to order one new, I would consider that color. It looked super sharp. I believe it had a grey interior. Mine is titanium grey metalic. The sport package came with sport seats and the interior is black leather. The car smells like a leather coat when you get in. Try to take one out again on an extended drive before you decide. Maybe you can take it up Angeles Crest hwy. :eek: I spent about 2 hours driving mine before I made up my mind to buy it.
 

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I agree with the general sentiments of Chuck. I still don't like iDrive but its not a big deal for someone familiar with technology. If your significant other (if there is one) is not comfortable with technology beware!

If you are getting a preowned car- Id be extra careful with any car model year prior to 2004. 2002= dont do it under any circumstance. It WILL be a headache.

I have a 2005 sport and it drives much like Chuck says- although I think it does understeer some and its clearly a wide vehicle. If you are specing a car here is what I think should be done:

sports package: shadowline trim+ lowering the car 3/4" + nicer steering wheel+ cool wheels. I really think this is how the default 7 should have been- people who were critical of the 7 before now come up to me and ask- wow, thats great looking, what happened?! No chrome trim and lower look + big wheels, thats what happened. I still am not 100% in love with the Bangle design, but I think the 7 with the sports package looks pretty darn good!

convenience package: a cool toy- it involves the auto shut doors- nice, but hardly necessary. And the auto open/close trunk. Thats my favorite part. If you have an infant the auto shut doors might be nice because they close quietly.

logic7: this should be standard. It sounds great for an OEM system- dont get a car without it.

i vs Li. If you plan on having people in the back regularly, get the Li- the space is amazing. The shorter wheelbase car will feel a little more nimble- but aside from cost, Id go for the Li- I think the car looks sleeker and the extra wheelbase + the big wheels/ harder suspension will give a smoother ride and the car will still handle well.

As to the facelift, it will largely be a redo of the headlights, grill and hood. Thats basically it- the rear end looks really close to the one of today. If you like the car as it is now and if its going to be a lease, go for it- but please be careful of the 2002-2003 cars, even some of the early 2004s can be trouble. This is not to knock the car Chuck has, I am talking about a general rule of thumb.
 

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Congrats on the Big 7 Mr C. :thumbsup:

Mr C always does his Due Dilligence. You can be assurred he got a good one.
:M5launch:
 

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MEnthusiast said:
As to the facelift, it will largely be a redo of the headlights, grill and hood. Thats basically it- the rear end looks really close to the one of today. If you like the car as it is now and if its going to be a lease, go for it- but please be careful of the 2002-2003 cars, even some of the early 2004s can be trouble. This is not to knock the car Chuck has, I am talking about a general rule of thumb.
The unbiased and informed people that I talked to indicated that with the latest 2004 software upgrade, the trouble spots have been taken care of. We'll see how long that holds true. It sure is a fantastic car to drive. I will be taking it to the track here in socal in the spring.
 
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