Originally Posted by Tom C

The GT-R has a 6 speed transmission vs the F10 M5's 7 speed. That is an inherent advantage for the F10 M5 provided the gearing is utilized correctly...

Originally Posted by BMWM5786

Link to the scans of the 0-300 km/h sportauto.fr test:

[scans] Sport Auto Fr. - 0-300 km/h event (Lotus F1, Veyron Grand Sport, GT-R, etc.)


Granted it was wet, but who's of the opinion that the F10 is faster than an SLS to 300 km/h? Gustav, do you still think the GT-R is slow above 200 km/h? 37.4 seconds seems quite fast to me.

Originally Posted by Tom C

First of all...I will not compare magazine times from EVO to Car & Driver. Car & Driver will not test cars on a wet track....I have found that EVO has done that time and again. As I said before, different magazines use different techniques and EVO seems to have a huge variation between tests. According to Car & Driver, they test cars's acceleration trying to keep the same relative amount of fuel (I believe half a tank of gas), they weather correct the data to a theoretical weather condition, use a 1 foot roll out to simulate a drag strip run (would only affect the start and not running acceleration times), and other standardized procedures. Sorry, mxing and matching different data from different tests is not scientifically sound and I will not indulge your illogical analysis.

Secondly, I used the 458 Italia and 911 GT2RS as examples of cars significantly faster than an E60 M5 0-150mph because you stated that the E60 M5's times was not that impressive. My point was that you have an exagerated sense of what is fast...so I needed some exagerated examples that would satisfy you sense of what is fast and impressive.

Thirdly, the reasons an F10 M5 can hang with an SLS are different than the reasons it can hang with 'a 12-'13 GT-R....which is a completely different discussion. The GT-R has a 6 speed transmission vs the F10 M5's 7 speed. That is an inherent advantage for the F10 M5 provided the gearing is utilized correctly...which seems to be the case given the acceleration figures. The SLS also has a 7 speed transmission, so that was a point not worth noting in comparison to the F10 M5 as there was no inherent advantage for either car. As others mentioned the GT-R has AWD which creates additional parasitic loss through the drivetrain which an F10 M5 does not have to contend with. I am well aware of the GT-R's aerodynamics which is probably an advantage for the GT-R over the F10 M5 given the larger frontal area of the F10 M5.

Fourthly, if you read what I actually wrote instead of some fantasized version you created in your head....you would see that I mentioned my prior ownership of a CL65 to relay that I have intimate knowledge of the SL65 Black Series drivetrain. I have first hand knowledge of how long the gearing is with the same 5 speed automatic transmission, same gearing, same differential and very similar power from a very similar powerplant (my CL65 dynoed a little more than a stock SL65 BS..but probably weighed a couple hundred pounds more when full sized spare/tools/other non-essentials removed).

Is it any surprise that an C63 PP is so fast? It has a 7 speed transmission, has good aerodynamics, weighs under 4K pounds, has nearly 500hp and you are comparing a car developed 6-7 years later than an E60 M5. The fact that E60 M5 is still very much in the conversation is a testament to its abilities.

I love high performance cars.... and I really like pretty much all of the cars in this discussion and don't "envy" any car (although I would give the proverbial left one for the 911 GT2RS).

Tom

Originally Posted by BMWM5786

I disagree with practically everything you said but I'm not going to go into a lengthy rebuttal due to time constraints, save to say that Car and Driver an consistency, there's an oxymoron if I ever heard one. I'll try to keep it as civil as possible without resorting to any snide remarks. I'll leave that to you.