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F10 M5 Discussion 2010- Discussion about the next upcoming generation M5 based on the next generation 5-series, the F10.


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Old 18th December 2009, 02:30   #1
Gustav
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Rumour on a comment on bmwblog

Saw this in a comment on bmwblog.com. Have no idea how muc truth there is in it.


"Just under 580 PS. The V8 although shared with the X5M and X6M is completely individual and unique to the M5. With BMW adapting the engine to suit the M5 and itís character itís not a complete transplant. Character in an M5 is essential as is the engine has to synergize with the DKG Transmission and the KERS.

The platform will be the same as the 5er sedan but pressed using aluminium instead of steel. This helps keep the cars weight down. For the first time BMW will offer the option of a Carbon Fibre Roof with the M5, and also for the first time BMW will offer a second more hardcore M5 which will trade some of the regular models luxuries for less weight and power."
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Last edited by Gustav; 18th December 2009 at 02:31.
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Old 18th December 2009, 13:35   #2
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Gustav, this is inside info from a BMW employee who's posting as SCOTT27 over at germancarzone.com.

His infos should be taken with a grain of salt, but he usually points the community into the right direction and is providing insights way before product introduction.

His original post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT27
M Division : The Road Ahead

New World Order - The New BMW M5.

Whilst it's true that the M Division has come in for quite a few comments regarding current product or lets not beat about the bush The BMW X5 M and BMW X6 M. Identified as the "next Chapter" in M. Derided by enthusiasts and journalists alike. Has the M Division lost it? Has the M Division lost it's focus? Does M stand for marketing now?
Does the M philosophy no longer remain pertinent?

Are some of the comments.

The Pinnacle of Efficient Dynamics.

With the creation of BMW Efficient Dynamics. Technology aimed at reducing fuel consumption without sacrificing driving pleasure and carbon dioxide emissions spreading throughout the BMW portfolio. One question remained unanswered how will the M Division benefit ? And how will the M division remain relevant in the long term?

BMW M Division will become the pinacle of Efficient Dynamics. Welcome to the Brave New World of Performance.

Lightweight construction.

BMW M cars will now seperate themselves from the core cars by utilising the same platform but for the relevant M model. The floorplan will be pressed in aluminium. As the core 5er begins to use lightweight materials such as aluminium on the door and bonnet skins, these will transfer over as will an optional Carbon Fibre reinforced roof - A first for an M5 , and a first for a BMW performance sedan.

BMW Active Aerodynamics

First showcased on the GINA Concept Car - A car that was way ahead of it's time and key component in the BMW Efficient Dynamics programme.
In principle to reduce drag and boost downforce and lower fuel consumption. Special Aerodynamic aids that will move automatically incorporated in the front of the car including the outeredge of the wheel arches , front bumpers and within the grille intake. Mini Turbines are incorporated in the grille which convert drag under braking into electricity.

KERS (Kinetic Energy recovery System)

The new M5 will spearhead a radical addition to further reduce consumption. Conceived well within when BMW were still commencing with their F1 Programme. With KERS developed for the F1 car , BMW also created a synergy for an application of such a system to a road car.
Successfully applied to the Road Car division the KERS developed by M division consists of an on-off-on again programme involving
Twin Parallell Supercapacitors between the driveshaft providing 10 sec power boost at the press of a button. The idea is to have stored up the energy and allow the driver to unleash the power on demand. An adaption of this idea will feature in the six cylinder Active Hybrid 5 Concept Car that will be shown in Geneva in March 2010.
Tests carried out within the confines of BMW's private proving grounds are ongoing as the KERS is relatively new tech. The development of the new car remains in status.

The Importance of Character

The V10 in the E60 M5 is truly a work of art. Although a V10 was considered and remains as a possible venture for an additional M model.
The new car inherits the V8 engine found within the BMW X5 and X6 M models. Although BMW stress that the engine will be unique to the M5 with Just under 580 PS.
The V8 although shared with the X5M and X6M is completely individual and unique to the M5. With BMW adapting the engine to suit the M5 and itís character itís not a complete transplant. Character in an M5 is essential as is sound. The engine has to synergize with the DKG Transmission and the KERS.
The V8 will in turn be faster and more powerful than the outgoing V10 and sound just as spectacular.
The V8 will also feature cylinder shutdown also to aid fuel consumption with overall figures expected to be between 25-30% better than the E60 M5.

Aswell as a unique engine , The M5 will inherit a Dual clutch transmission which will be unique to the M5, based upon the 7 speeder found within the current M3 , eight Gears will be available and will be equipped with a stop-start control. The DCT will also be operated with steering wheel mounted paddles. The M5 although not at first will also be available with optional Carbon Fibre brakes, currently being trialled.
Customisable driving options will also feature as will a new electronic stability control with torque vectoring and roll control.
Efficient Dynamics features will also be available from the touch of a switch.

Designed for Performance

The M5's secret has always been to remain understated and discreet on the outside , but within lies the beast.
Typical M5 and BMW M aerodynamic features adorn the car. With the new 5er central grille being much larger the central intake size has been diminished , although the brake outlets are larger. Wheel arches are swollen to add some mass on the F10's athletic muscle. A side air intake is placed underneath the character line which climaxes at the wheel arch.
The Side skirts are more sculptured alllowing for good aerodynamics.
At the rear the typical Quad exhausts remain with a sculpted diffuser and central intake. A small bootlid spoiler allows the car to remain understated.
and restrained.

What Comes After?

In addition to the standard luxury performance sedan BMW will offer a more hardcore model in the same vain as the BMW M5 CSL 25th anniversary car. Swapping Luxuries for Performance and being as hardcore as they come. Not available at first but coming on steam eighteen months later. BMW want to expand the M cars by having the core model and something more inclined for enthusiasts.

A Touring model is under consideration.

Just as BMW teased the E60. The F10 BMW M5 will bow as a Production concept at the 2011 Geneva Autoshow with the production model debuting in the early summer before the world premiere at the IAA Frankfurt in 2011. European sales begin at the same time.
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Old 18th December 2009, 18:49   #3
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Seems very credible, great info. Thanks.
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Old 18th December 2009, 19:37   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gustav View Post
Saw this in a comment on bmwblog.com. Have no idea how muc truth there is in it.


"Just under 580 PS. The V8 although shared with the X5M and X6M is completely individual and unique to the M5. With BMW adapting the engine to suit the M5 and itís character itís not a complete transplant. Character in an M5 is essential as is the engine has to synergize with the DKG Transmission and the KERS.

The platform will be the same as the 5er sedan but pressed using aluminium instead of steel. This helps keep the cars weight down. For the first time BMW will offer the option of a Carbon Fibre Roof with the M5, and also for the first time BMW will offer a second more hardcore M5 which will trade some of the regular models luxuries for less weight and power."
Seems to confirm what was in the CAR magazine article posted yesterday where they were reporting 578bhp
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Old 19th December 2009, 13:47   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m630 View Post
Seems to confirm what was in the CAR magazine article posted yesterday where they were reporting 578bhp
If the article quotes just under 580 PS, that would translate into slightly OVER 580 bhp, since PS is about 98.6% of bhp. Either way, it should be impressive if it holds up as the truth.
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Old 19th December 2009, 15:06   #6
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I would be surprised if they've finalized the power output (specific tuning) of the engine already. I assume they are still testing, tweaking, and computer-modelling the engine in various boost levels, cam settings, etc. I recall many different reports of the S85 V10 at this point in its development process. I'm sure many of them were actually correct, but were not final. With that said, this seems credible and likely in the general area of the production vehicle.

I'm curious about the aluminum floorpan. This is a huge change over the series car given that aluminum and steel are very different in terms of size, strength, manufacturing/welding, etc. There's obviously an enormous amount of reengineering required beyond a cavalier "let just replace steel with aluminum in the floorpan."

KERS is interesting. I hope it doesn't add too much weight given that it will rarely be used in a street car. Here is a quick article on it in F1: The lowdown on KERS - Feature - F1 | ITV Sport

I frankly hate the carbon footprint language in the description. I'm hoping that this is just marketing BS for the gullible masses and that significant compromises were not made to its performance or economics in achieving it.
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Old 19th December 2009, 17:23   #7
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Through a collection of sources (one of which is the always interesting Scott27) we’ve been able to piece together a good idea of what the next generation (F10) M5 will offer. For starters the engine will be similar (but not identical) to the twin turbo V8 in the X5 and X6 M SAVs. We expect an output around 570 bhp with dramatically more torque (well over 500ft lbs) than the current E60 M5 thanks to those two turbos. BMW has gone to great lengths to make the F10 M5 have more usable power a la the masterpiece that was the E39 M5. The turbos will help however the M engineers have also created an engine that is less about a high strung shriek at 8000 rpm and more about everyday power (and lots of it).

But what about the perceived softening of the M brand? Reportedly the M Division will be doing something about that with the F10. With carbon fiber used for some body panels and an optional carbon fiber roof, their aim is to bring weight down as much as possible. Further we’ve now heard from two sources that M is planning to recreate the entire platform in Aluminum to dramatically reduce the weight of the structure. Reportedly the E60 M5 CSL one-off was a proof of concept engineering test mule that helped engineers vet out much of these ideas.

Then there’s the rumor of a KERS system that debuted in this years BMW F1 race car? While many sources have claimed it’s coming, we haven’t heard details until now. While they’re unconfirmed, one of our more accurate sources, Scott27, has not only confirmed KERS but has given us technical insight into how the system will work. According to him (or her), it will be a brake energy regeneration system with an electric motor located in the car’s transmission. Stored energy is released by an F1 like switch allowing for extra bursts power for a short time period. In some ways this mirrors the MINI Cooper S, JCW, and the Z4 35is in their short burst of extra torque available at full acceleration. However we’re told to expect something a bit more noticeable and immediate with KERS.

What remains to be seen is what transmission will be motivating this power to the ground. We’ve heard rumors for over a year now that BMW will offering only one transmission with the F10 and it won’t be a manual. Again we point the the E60 M5 CSL as our answer. Reports indicated that a beefed up version of the M3’s DCT will find its way into the M5 with 7 forward gears and lightening fast shift times. Of course if it was our choice we’d stick a slick shutting short throw manual transmission in there and call it a day but surprisingly BMW didn’t ask.


BimmerFile Archive Next Generation M5 Comes into Focus
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Old 19th December 2009, 17:37   #8
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It does seem credible Gustav, I cannot wait until these details are ironed out.
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Old 2nd January 2010, 20:31   #9
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I hope that is true with the two models it would be nice if they had a sport and a luxury one that way the sport could have more power and luxury can make you feel important.....
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Old 5th January 2010, 05:52   #10
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Wow...you know you're crazy for m5's when theres an entire thread dedicated to comments on a rumor.... about a comment.... found on a blog.

Can't wait for some officially official specs....until then i guess the madness will continue.
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