M6 vs 6 Series V8 TT

[m630]

hi all,

with the announcement that BMW will begin offering the X6 with the new petrol V8 Twin Turbo, what are current M owners thoughts on the prospect of the e63 6 series with the new engine??

M6 currently has 507hp @ 7750 with 383 lb/ft @ 6100 while the new engine will deliver 407hp @ 5500 with 446 lb/ft from 1750 thru 4500rpms stock.
Now think about a chip and some other minor mods and ... do you think it will give the V10 a serious run that may surpass the beast? Just based on what the 335i has been able to do with the new TT V6 and a chip, i can only imagine what the new V8 will be capable of, which then leads to the next question, what is M going to to to up the M6/M5s???

[///Marshall]

As discussed in a recent, controversial thread, Dinan has shown that
you can get over 600hp by stroking the current motor. I suspect
the M division has a few more tricks up their sleeve should they
choose to stick with NA.

[T Bone]

To make these 7 speed cars fly, you need high torque in the last 3000 rpm.... Turbos typically don't deliver this, favoring low end torque for driveability.

You would need to tune the turbo motor to give torque up high.

[sechsgang]

small vvt turbos would do the trick for high end...but I like NA way too much on this gal...haha

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by sechsgang

small vvt turbos would do the trick for high end...but I like NA way too much on this gal...haha

I disagree with respect.....

VVT turbos are a compromise....if you want oodles of power in the high end, you want BIG BAD turbos....they are the only ones that can deliver the flow.

But you also get turbo lag with these things and forget about linerarity and throttle response.

[sechsgang]

Originally Posted by T Bone

I disagree with respect.....

VVT turbos are a compromise....if you want oodles of power in the high end, you want BIG BAD turbos....they are the only ones that can deliver the flow.

But you also get turbo lag with these things and forget about linerarity and throttle response.

yes, thats why the VVTs I feel would be the perfect way to amp up the power but not amp up the lag very much, a VVT turbo doesnt need to be particularly small either, there are many particularly cool hybrids that could be used...taht said, Im all for NA anyhow in the M5...if you want a fast TT car, get a Porsche!

[Sticky]

The situation will be similar to M3 vs. 335i. The turbo solution will be cheaper, and easily tuneable. The M6 will be more fun to drive and has the spectacular NA motor.

BMW entering the turbo arena sure is interesting.

[chiromikey]

Originally Posted by T Bone

To make these 7 speed cars fly, you need high torque in the last 3000 rpm.... Turbos typically don't deliver this, favoring low end torque for driveability.

You would need to tune the turbo motor to give torque up high.

are you really saying you don't think a turbo motor could deliver more tq than the current v10 at high rpms? i wouldn't exactly call the 383lb.ft. high...or a remotely tough order to fill for a tt set up.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by chiromikey

are you really saying you don't think a turbo motor could deliver more tq than the current v10 at high rpms? i wouldn't exactly call the 383lb.ft. high...or a remotely tough order to fill for a tt set up.

No..... I am talking about for many modern turbo motors (the ones with variable vane stuff to reduce lag), the torque curve falls off in the high rpms. This is a design decision.

Ideal acceleration car would be a high revver like the current V10 with turbos reaching peak efficiency in the high rpm band. This of course would be unacceptable today because their would be little (relative) torque down low and stupid power that would turn on like a switch.

[Phantom of the Opera]

welcome to the cross roads of tunning, for ages naturally aspirated cars have been the model for BMW. with non M's cars surpassing M's in every which way BMW & BMW motor sports has a problem. with the introduction of a amped v8 the pure bread race titans of long ago for BMW seems to have taken a back seat to consumer demand. Very Sad.

[Sticky]

Originally Posted by Phantom of the Opera

welcome to the cross roads of tunning, for ages naturally aspirated cars have been the model for BMW. with non M's cars surpassing M's in every which way BMW & BMW motor sports has a problem. with the introduction of a amped v8 the pure bread race titans of long ago for BMW seems to have taken a back seat to consumer demand. Very Sad.

I disagree. There always were motors available that beat the M's in brute force. Nothing has changed. The M motors still offer the experience they were designed to give. BMW just has diversified and offers the best of both worlds, awesome turbos, and awesome naturally aspirated motors.

Porsche has had it figured out for a while.