Comprehensive S85 Rod Bearing Picture Thread - Page 7 - BMW M5 Forum and M6 Forums
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post #61 of 792 Old 12th October 2013, 04:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjav8b View Post
Agreed. I do think it is odd though that some of these engines will burn alot of oil and some will burn very little. Mine stopped burning oil at 20k miles. Before that I had to add a liter between changes.
I think oil consumption is related to several factors, the way the car is driven, ambient temps, type of oil, life of the oil, mileage on engine. But the way the car is driven at high rpms especially causes it to burn oil. At least mine does.
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post #62 of 792 Old 14th October 2013, 06:12 PM
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Best advice for everyone is to replace your bearings with non-coated and thinner bearings than factory. Clearances are just too tight for the application and adding TWS oil doesn't help the equation. If you swap your bearings out for the same size, consider changing the oil you use. Also, as a precaution, even if the vanos line looks ok, replace it.

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post #63 of 792 Old 14th October 2013, 06:46 PM Thread Starter
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IMO, the only exception to that is the WPC treated bearings sold by AutoTalent et al. The coating is followed up by a sort of shot peening process which creates a work hardening effect on the friction surface of the bearing shell and actually thins it a bit, increasing the clearance.

However, even with the slightly increased clearance, I still will not put the TWS molasses in my engine again. Fool me once, shame on me; fool my twice, go 'eff yourself.


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post #64 of 792 Old 15th October 2013, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PRM5 View Post
Oil consumption has nothing to do with rod bearing wear.
Right, amen!

I keep reading post after post about guys who changed the rod bearings and then report that oil consumption is less. Little do they know that rod bearing do not eat oil. In the shortblock (bottom end), oil is usually used up through the piston rings and not the rod bearings. In the top half of the motor, oil is usually used up through the valve stem seals.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjav8b View Post
Agreed. I do think it is odd though that some of these engines will burn alot of oil and some will burn very little. Mine stopped burning oil at 20k miles. Before that I had to add a liter between changes.
Some oil consumption is normal in every engine, although some use more than others. I have 104K miles on my 2006 and I use roughly one quart or so between oil changes...I change oil roughly every 6K miles. I use either Mobil 1 10w-40 or Castrol 5w-50 oil...I never, ever used the factory recommended TWS 10w-60, and I never followed that goofy 15,000 miles oil change interval...not even on my wife's 550i sports package.

For those who do not know, many of those rod bearing shots posted looked normal...yes, this may come to a shock for most of you. No rod bearing on this planet will appear blemish free after a few thousand miles. 99% of your engine wear occurs during start up, so if you want to help your engine live a good live, then use a good quality synthetic oil that circulates really fast to all critical engine parts. A 0w-40 or 5w-50 works just fine, but if you cant find either, a 10w-40 will work just fine. Remember, these are multi viscosity oils - W for winter (meaning, it will flow well at 0* or 5* or 10* degrees) and the last number (40 or 50 or 60 weight) indicates thickness once it is heated.

A little thinner oil will provide a more audible engine valvetrain noise, but it will flow much better especially in the cold or when the engine is cold like in the morning. Remember, just because you live in a desert or in hot climated, it does not mean that you should use thicker oil...keep in mind that most of engine wear occurs during start up and as long as your engine/oil does not run super hot, then oil breakdown is less likely to happen...viscosity breakdown hurts your rod bearings much like low oil psi. Another thing, do not follow BMW 15,000 miles change intervals, that is total BS IMO.

Hope this helps

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post #65 of 792 Old 15th October 2013, 02:57 PM
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Are we saying that the pics in this thread are 'normal' and that all rod bearings will look that worn out?
Has anyone here taken their bearings out and they did not look as bad?
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post #66 of 792 Old 15th October 2013, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hard5 View Post
Right, amen!

I keep reading post after post about guys who changed the rod bearings and then report that oil consumption is less. Little do they know that rod bearing do not eat oil. In the shortblock (bottom end), oil is usually used up through the piston rings and not the rod bearings. In the top half of the motor, oil is usually used up through the valve stem seals.



Some oil consumption is normal in every engine, although some use more than others. I have 104K miles on my 2006 and I use roughly one quart or so between oil changes...I change oil roughly every 6K miles. I use either Mobil 1 10w-40 or Castrol 5w-50 oil...I never, ever used the factory recommended TWS 10w-60, and I never followed that goofy 15,000 miles oil change interval...not even on my wife's 550i sports package.

For those who do not know, many of those rod bearing shots posted looked normal...yes, this may come to a shock for most of you. No rod bearing on this planet will appear blemish free after a few thousand miles. 99% of your engine wear occurs during start up, so if you want to help your engine live a good live, then use a good quality synthetic oil that circulates really fast to all critical engine parts. A 0w-40 or 5w-50 works just fine, but if you cant find either, a 10w-40 will work just fine. Remember, these are multi viscosity oils - W for winter (meaning, it will flow well at 0* or 5* or 10* degrees) and the last number (40 or 50 or 60 weight) indicates thickness once it is heated.

A little thinner oil will provide a more audible engine valvetrain noise, but it will flow much better especially in the cold or when the engine is cold like in the morning. Remember, just because you live in a desert or in hot climated, it does not mean that you should use thicker oil...keep in mind that most of engine wear occurs during start up and as long as your engine/oil does not run super hot, then oil breakdown is less likely to happen...viscosity breakdown hurts your rod bearings much like low oil psi. Another thing, do not follow BMW 15,000 miles change intervals, that is total BS IMO.

Hope this helps

Thanks,
Hard5
How is recommending Mobil 1 10w-40 any better than TWS 10w-60? We already know the TWS sheets down to a high 40 after a few thousand miles. You aren't getting any improvements from the Mobil 1 10w-40 with cold start viscosity or wear.

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post #67 of 792 Old 15th October 2013, 11:03 PM
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I'll stick with TWS thanks. Regarding the wear on those bearings, its normal for this car i think.

Last edited by MIGHTY5; 15th October 2013 at 11:04 PM.
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post #68 of 792 Old 16th October 2013, 07:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335xi View Post
Are we saying that the pics in this thread are 'normal' and at all rod bearings will look that worn out?
Has anyone here taken their bearings out and they did not look as bad?
Yes, some of those bearings appear to have normal wear. Again, no bearing will have a blemish free appearance after at least 6K miles. Noticed I said some bearings.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SuckaGDog View Post
How is recommending Mobil 1 10w-40 any better than TWS 10w-60? We already know the TWS sheets down to a high 40 after a few thousand miles. You aren't getting any improvements from the Mobil 1 10w-40 with cold start viscosity or wear.
Buy one quart of both oils brands and compare. Here is my non-scientific test: take some paper towel and pour oil from each bottle into the paper towel over an empty container and see which oil brand flows better/faster...cold right out of the bottle. Then, heat up the oil...this is how I did it: took half of quart of each brand and heated up over the stove using one of my old cooking pot found in the garage. I cooked it to 230* degrees or so and conducted the same paper towel pour test and guess what? That mofo TWS oil did not flow like the M1. I conducted this backyard test years ago when I first got my M5 shortly after reading that BMW suggested running the TWS 10w-60 oil; the alternative oils were
5w-50 or 10w-40 so I stuck with the alternatives. Now with 104K miles later and counting, my M5 still makes over 465rhwp and uses 1 to 1.5 qtrs of oil [depending on my driving style] between oil changes every (6,500k) miles.

You guys do whatever you think it is best for your ride.

Hope this helps

Thanks,
Hard5
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post #69 of 792 Old 16th October 2013, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hard5 View Post
Yes, some of those bearings appear to have normal wear. Again, no bearing will have a blemish free appearance after at least 6K miles. Noticed I said some bearings.




Buy one quart of both oils brands and compare. Here is my non-scientific test: take some paper towel and pour oil from each bottle into the paper towel over an empty container and see which oil brand flows better/faster...cold right out of the bottle. Then, heat up the oil...this is how I did it: took half of quart of each brand and heated up over the stove using one of my old cooking pot found in the garage. I cooked it to 230* degrees or so and conducted the same paper towel pour test and guess what? That mofo TWS oil did not flow like the M1. I conducted this backyard test years ago when I first got my M5 shortly after reading that BMW suggested running the TWS 10w-60 oil; the alternative oils were
5w-50 or 10w-40 so I stuck with the alternatives. Now with 104K miles later and counting, my M5 still makes over 465rhwp and uses 1 to 1.5 qtrs of oil [depending on my driving style] between oil changes every (6,500k) miles.

You guys do whatever you think it is best for your ride.
O
Hope this helps
w
Thanks,
Hard5
Wish you had done this test with liqui moly 10w60, also i have pulled bearings on other engines past 100k miles and have never seen the uneven wear pattern the top bearing shows on this engine, to me the bottom shell is normal

Last edited by PRM5; 16th October 2013 at 12:14 PM.
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post #70 of 792 Old 16th October 2013, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PRM5 View Post
Wish you had done this test with liqui moly 10w60, also i have pulled bearings on other engines past 100k miles and have never seen the uneven wear pattern the top bearing shows on this engine, to me the bottom shell is normal
Did you read the bearing thread/wiki over at M3Post? The very first post said they don't recommend running Liqui Moly due to the fact it's cold properties are even worse than TWS.

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