How badly has your business suffered in this economy? - Page 24 - The Unofficial BMW M5 Messageboard (m5board.com)

Gustav · 14th September 2009, 19:56

I think thaty might be a good move over the longer perspective.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgeSmooth

Seems like every corner of the globe is affected. Down in SA my hotel and conference business is down by 30% this year. We have decided to take the knock as owners and not lay off anyone.

Sharpie12 · 18th September 2009, 19:21

During the past month I've invoiced my biggest customer at least 400% less than I usually do. Thankfully I've picked up some other customers to pick up the slack.

Dirkies · 19th September 2009, 14:58

I work in IT:
new philosophy of upper management: since the worst is yet to come most economics say (politicians of course say the opposite, but we know they are all liars), they decided, after already costcutting most of the year on all kinda expenses (salaries frozen, less flights, cheaper hotels, no restaurants, no parties, even electricity savings!) they now started to fire some of the best people of the company (not the most expensive ones, but the easiest ones to fire), as saving those salaries means less painful decisions when it is too late

(I guess 'painful' means when it hurts their pockets!). Others company divisions are moved to low salary countries (know-how and accumulated experience does not count in the decision, just cold hard cash).Short-sighted decisions, stupid, stupid.
US States (which are some of our customers) cannot pay their invoices (all frozen), other customers refuse to pay their maintenance, even inventing complaints to justify not paying maintenance, new sales are still more or less stable but prospects are a lot more difficult before buying, competition is a lot harder and unforgiving than 2 years ago, all tricks allowed to snatch a deal.

I had the not so nice job to fire most of my people and go rehire cheaper ones in another country. 1,5 years ago we had on a now hiring announcement 20something resumes in 1 month. Now i got 180+ in 2 weeks! Managers, Level 3 engineers, etc, all applying for a level 1 engineer job! People making 60K before willing to work for 30K. Even 2 women working in IT before, were made redundant last year, one now working as hotel receptionist and other in a ... slaughterhouse! Crazy shizz.

I know others trying to get rid of their Mercs, Audi's and BMWs as they cannot afford them anymore. They are not even getting 1 phonecall per month unless they lower their prices way below the usual market price. The carmarket is dead over here, my BMW dealer said the sales damage is limited, but it is sooo hard to sell the car, clients just get very anal on details now. Even know of 2nd hand 2yr old white E60 M5 with low mileage sitting already for 8 months at a BMW dealership in Brussels, they just can't get rid of it, price is now lowered to 1/4th of new price (yes, around 25K euro!!), but still no-one buys as the taxes to drive a car over there are just incredibly high (add at least 10K when you buy it for roadtax, insurance, etc). And the color seems also not to help much. Other story I heard about Merc R350 being sold after bankruptcy. Asking price was 40K. Publicly sold. No takers. So they were stuck with car. A friend of mine called them and said "I'll give ya 19K for it". Guy on phone laughed him away, saying the price was ridiculously low... 2 months later he called him again, if he still wanted to buy for....19K...

He told them to go F themselves.

My M5 is paid, I got no outstanding loans or mortgages, make good money (touch wood) so I am pretty relaxed at night, but still keep my eyes very open on what is happening around me and globally, the last 'firing wave' came suddenly, I escaped by a few inches getting fired aswell, but the next wave I may not survive, I just dunno, I live from quarter to quarter, and keep driving my M5 of course

Another friend lost his credit line, bank where he is customer since ages, never had a single payment issue, earns good money, has quite some money stashed over there, and was now working on a big hotel construction project. His wife got diagnosed with a brain tumor (but in meantime she had successful treatment), and within a week the bank magically heard of this issue, and called him to say they cancelled his credit line just because of that!!! (she is actually insured for it, but bank did not care, just suddenly 'too risky' for them) He said he will have to declare bankruptcy if he cannot find another bank within a month. Damn banks, they ruin you even if you have not done anything wrong.

I think the US Dollar currency is the most dangerous weakness of the current world economy, with their trillions of debt it is unsustainable, it will collapse one day, and if it is dropped as international reserve currency, it is over and out for the US and we're in for a long world recession (at least I live in a euro country, my savings would not vaporize, but we all know without the US nothing else works).
But most of the current situation should be indeed blamed on GREED, avoid the Bush/Obama rethoric. I enjoy watching left wing blogs on the web or right wing TV like Fox News, they are both hilarious and ridiculous, too bad quite some actually believe all the BS what is written/said over there. I watched 2 good DVDs back from 2006 which scarily predicted what happened in 2008 in the US. 'In Debt We Trust' and 'Maxed Out' (just google for them adding 'rapidshare.com' in the search terms, they are easy to find). Quite a sobering thing to watch, esp since these were made in 2006 but look like they were made in 2009, so damn accurate!

And regarding the whole healthcare debate: I do not live in a 'socialist' country, I am not a Michael Moore fan either, but just to give you an idea: know a woman over here who needed urgent cancer surgery. All went well, she is ok again. She lives off 900 euro a month half-time salary as barmaid. Has a kid, divorced, alone. No extra health insurance but just the public one. The whole medical stuff over a 2 month period costed out of her own pocket... 235 euro! (total amount she never knew, but we expect it was over 5K)
An ex-colleague of mine his wife had exactly same cancer and treatment, but they live in the US. Luckily they work both, as they had to pay out of their OWN pocket (despite part being reimbursed by their health insurance).... $8,000! I guess the first woman over here would have been dead by now if she lived in the US... so is it really that fair to exclude the public option? Yes? Even if that woman happened to be your friend or some family member, would it still be fair to let her die as she cannot afford treatment? Indeed no ***** panel to be seen, the actual ***** panel is her bank! It is all about the GREEDY private sector (here we have that GREED word again

) wanting to protect their cash-cows, nothing more, nothing less.
Other example: my brother was with his wife on holiday in US, she fainted, was brought for checkup to US hospital. Turned out all fine. But security did not allow them to leave the hospital after 1 day, unless he paid the bill first... $5,000 ! Ambulance, bed, everything, just ridiculous (over here it would be...FREE!) He was shocked as not used to such policies, as in Europe they just let you go, not even real security in hospitals. Luckily his health insurance in Europe will repay him (but took him a lawsuit threat as initially his company refused due to amount, but luckily for my brother the contract did not exclude US territory from coverage

). Lesson learnt: as a European, don't get sick and don't break any bones while being in the US...

If that means I am a socialist now, well, I do not like socialism, but seems it works out better then the system in the land of the free. I already had to tell one US colleague who said I was living in a socialist country that, if really so, then the fact I drive an M5, must mean I am member of the party elite over here

Hell with it, socialist or capitalist, democrat or republican..."whether you are rich or poor, it's nice to have money"

Daytona Bones · 19th September 2009, 18:47

Dirkies,

Well said. Its always very interesting to hear commentaries and observations from people in other countries on the U.S.'s economic and health care discourse.

DB

DoctorWill · 20th September 2009, 00:05

Don't be discouraged, doctors will always have a higher than average paying job. The population is still outgrowing physician training so far. the main problem with healthcare is that few of us are paying for the rest of the population who benefit from not working and receiving money and free healthcare. I don't mind taking care of the disabled, but handing money and benefit out free is wrong, it cuts out the incentive to work for something. Our tax dolloars are simply wasted.

I am a state employee and works for non-profit and private clinics. State of california just cut our salaries for 15% while still paying contractors twice our pay, how does that sound? I see all the money state government is wasting everyday due to bureaucracy and outright disregard of responsibilities. Federal government is probably even worse.

Dirkies · 20th September 2009, 18:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoctorWill

the main problem with healthcare is that few of us are paying for the rest of the population who benefit from not working and receiving money and free healthcare. I don't mind taking care of the disabled, but handing money and benefit out free is wrong, it cuts out the incentive to work for something. Our tax dolloars are simply wasted.

I understand it is a 'culture shock' for Americans to have an idea of public healthcare, but with such logic in mind, why does the US spend millions (or even billions) a year on 3rd world development aid, plus handing out billions to a lot of allies all over the world just to keep them allies etc? All taxmoney you will never see anything in return.

Apply that logic to your M5 insurance. Hell, I paid since 2001 for my 2 M3s and then the M5 about 20,000 euro in insurance, and only got about 2,000 euro of covered damage over all these years. Does that mean I should not pay my insurance anymore, as it is clearly a waste of money, moreover my insurance company still makes annual losses in their car-insurance business, as my other 18,000 euro I never got anything in return, was spent on idiots who crashed their cars and got a lot more back then what they paid for. Well, I can live with that, as if tomorrow I bend my M5, I will get more than double of 8 years of insurance in return on the fly, that is the other side of the medal.

So should the US govt stop handing out ANY taxpayer money which does not benefit US taxpayers directly? Screw allies, screw the 3rd world, UN, IMF, G20, G8... just think of yourselves...

But that just does not make sense, this is narrow-minded logic. The US has always been known to be generous spenders when disasters happen (natural or famine etc) or reconstruction of destroyed countries is needed (like the Marshall plan after WW2), but on the other hand, they refuse to help out their unfortunate FELLOW citizens (I am not talking about illegals!) because they cannot pay for it?!
I pay about 11% of my salary for public healthcare, and I know I paid a lot more than I benefited from over the past 10 years (I get rarely sick, and I have not been to a hospital since 25 years!) but I do not complain some others 'consume' my tax-euros and actually never worked for them (not just eldery, also youngsters etc). All this just because I know the day I have to go to the hospital, I will not be ruined or even been refused treatment because I can't pay for it, I will be just fine and treated correctly. Even when I become victim of the crisis and lose my job. And I have close friends who had serious health issues, they all still live and are not ruined or even took a financial setback. Crazy to think people in the US get stressed just about getting sick, just because they fear it may financially ruin them! This is something I just cannot imagine happening to me 1 day. Something must change over there, I do not have the answer either, but I hope both sides realize the current system is rotten and extremely unfair, and should change. Change into what, well, none of my business, I'm not a US citizen, but just show the world you can take CARE of your own folks, as we do over here since WW2, independent of their income.

ur20v · 20th September 2009, 19:41

Wow you are on a roll, keep it coming and well said.

Our health care in the UK with the National Health service is brilliant... yes it has some faults but on the whole its the best! Being able to turn up to hospital, any hospital and recieve care with out having to go to your wallet first and prove you have insurrance or can pay, I just couldn't imagin it any other way!

Why Daniel Hannan the conservative MP went to the states to rubbish the NHS is anyones guess but 'feathering his own nest' with his own agenda which isn't shared with the rest of the country is my guess plus I would put money on him being in private sector health care and wonder if we dug deeper would we find he had a vested interest in private health care in the states??!.

My mother had cancer and would never have been able to afford health if there had been any charge for the pills let alone the hospital care and treament so I would guess if we lived in the states she would not be here now!

Jay

DoctorWill · 20th September 2009, 21:48

I absolutely agree! Why spend so much on the allies and the third world countries when US citizens are under-educated, under-insured, and have little public programs? I don't want to sound skeptical, but it seems that money trickling down tends to be siphoned away downstream. Therefore it seems to be easier to make money from these generous funds when it's outside of US. I see enough wasting on a county and state level to realize that we're lucky if 5 to 10% are being used for the original intention. Imagine how freely money flow away on a global and international leve!

I am not advocating that the underprivileged should be left alone and die...although it would greatly reduce the demand for the resources overall. I believe that people need to work for their benefits, just like those of us who actually go to school and then work for our money! Help doesn't have to be in the form of free money and food stamps and housing susidies. People should still work for these benefits, even if it means mowing lawns and growing food or even crushing rocks to make pebbles and sands...etc. Why would a Mother want to work if she can continue to have children and receive money for each of them and free insurance and housing assistance? Where is the benefit for working? America is too full of generations of freeloaders supported by the government. We need to reward the hard working people!

DoctorWill · 20th September 2009, 21:51

BTW, is this going to come back and bite me when I run for public office in 10 years?

m5baller · 20th September 2009, 22:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by DoctorWill

BTW, is this going to come back and bite me when I run for public office in 10 years?

God help us that there will be a change within the next 10 years that will place us where we were just post WW-II. Where, as you stated in the prior post, we had ethics that distinguished us in the world. Where we had pride in what this country stood for, we allowed God, our backbone, to be uttered in academia and we did not train our poor and immigrants to rely on entitlements.

It has to happen, were broke and the hard working class, will stop working hard if that can not reap what they earned while watching others benefit from there hard work, sacrifice to their family, and toll on their health.

Why this is not understood by the lazy politicians and power unions is confounding to me. It pisses me off, that at a time of sacrifice, training and hard work, that it is my time to prosper and I have to deal with this crap. What are the current young generations on the brink of independence getting from this? Corruption and a attitude of "me first" are the ground rules of prosperity.

Being an American is starting to suck. Being a Californian is pathetic and I am embarrassed.