QUESTION: Does anyone have the DINAN BRAKES and if so......... - The Unofficial BMW M5 Messageboard (m5board.com)

FAST 5 · 15th November 2002, 04:30

Are they good or significantly better than the stock brake system?
Does anyone know how much the Dinan brakes go for? I checked out the Dinan site and did not see any pricing info. of the Dinan brakes. Thanks Guys!
Robert

BostonRocket · 15th November 2002, 06:49

Robert,

Dinan does not make brakes for our car. I am unsure even if they make brakes in general. their website is very up to date, so whatever is not on there, they do not make it.

My, the mod bug has certainly gotten a hold of you.

'Rocket

FAST 5 · 15th November 2002, 09:03

I just received Dinan's brochure, which contains all the current goodies for the M5 car as well as the 540i. The brakes that Dinan offers is for the 540i, and not for the M5 car. My fault for not reading carefully. If they make them for the 540i why not for the M5 ???
Robert

stever · 15th November 2002, 09:35

Dinan's 540 brakes are Euro 840 brakes or some such which are not any better than the M5 brakes -- search the previous posts for comments on StopTech vs Brembo vs Movit

mola · 15th November 2002, 09:41

Quote:

Originally posted by FAST 5
I just received Dinan's brochure, which contains all the current goodies for the M5 car as well as the 540i. The brakes that Dinan offers is for the 540i, and not for the M5 car. My fault for not reading carefully. If they make them for the 540i why not for the M5 ???
Robert

540i brakes are smaller than M5 brakes.

M5 rotors have directional vanes, larger rotors, larger pads, larger calipers than a 540i brakes.

540i rotors have straight vanes (non directional), saller size rotors vs m5 but bigger than 528i rotors, smaller pads vs m5 but larger than 528i, smaller caliper than M5 but bigger than 528i's etc.

The frame that mounts to the car it self is the same... so someone with a 540i can mount M5 brakes to their E39... M5 owner could mount 540i brakes (with caliper frames) but would be worse than stock.

So if you really wanted to put those Dinan brakes on for just looks... maybe it has the (D) on the calipers... then it would fit but why bother since it sounds like the Dinan brake kit is to bring up the size of the 540i brakes to the size of M5 brakes.

You could... go bigger brakes (stop tech or brembo's) and sell your M5 brakes to someone who has a 525i, 528i, 530i or 540i E39 instead... just a thought.

Mola

----

Looks like I was slow at posting and stever above pretty much answered it as well...
It seems we both agree the objective should be to go bigger :-)

15th November 2002, 10:02

You should get the Brembo front brakes (it is amazing how tightly they bind). Brembo just released a rear brake kit too. The rears may be overkill, but what the heck...the more the better.

Cheers.

FAST 5 · 15th November 2002, 12:44

the best place to get the BREMBO brakes for the M5 car?
Can you provide me with a web site address, phone number, etc.
Thanks for the PM reply.
Robert

DZeckhausen · 15th November 2002, 16:00

Quote:

Originally posted by FAST 5
the best place to get the BREMBO brakes for the M5 car?
Can you provide me with a web site address, phone number, etc.
Thanks for the PM reply.
Robert

Before you jump into the Brembo brakes, you should really check out the other options. Since I am also in northern NJ (Maplewood), it would be easy for you to swing by and check out the Mov'it brakes that I have (front and rear) on my 540i/6 as well as my Impala SS.

If your goal is a more balanced brake system for the shortest possible stopping distances, the StopTech engineers claim that their kit is superior than Brembo. They say that the Brembo caliper currently offered for the M5 is more front-biased than stock and that their kit, with caliper pistons specifically sized for the M5, yields shorter stopping distances, better pedal feel, and better results in the ABS J-turn test. Their 355mm rotors can absorb more heat than the 322mm Mov'it rotors and their patented internal vane design is supposed to be better at cooling than Porsche/Mov'it or Brembo.

If you hope to retain your stock wheels, the StopTech kit is the only one which will fit without wheel spacers. Both Brembo and Mov'it require spacers with the M5 wheels. If you have aftermarket wheels, it may be possible to fit any of the kits without spacers.

I would be glad to help you make and implement whatever choice in brakes works best for you. I'm a StopTech dealer, but my business isn't really launched yet and I still consider myself an enthusiast rather than a vendor. As other folks can testify, I won't let a financial interest get in the way of helping you get whatever works best for your car and your goals. If you decide Mov'it is the way to go, I'll introduce you to Steve D'Gerolamo who is the owner of Ultimate Garage (also in NJ) and the distributor of Mov'it brakes in North America. Mov'it is in the process of shifting from Porsche parts to their own manufactured parts, so Steve would be in the best position to tell you what new products are on the way from them. If you want Brembo, I'll introduce you to Brad Otoupalik at EvoSport, a quality Brembo vendor who has plenty of BMW E39 experience. And, of course, if you want StopTech brakes, I'll be glad to help you out there myself. And I can install any of those kits for you. I've done tons of E39 BMW installations, so you won't need to worry about getting it done right.

Just let me know how I can help.

doug · 15th November 2002, 16:55

Quote:

and that their kit, with caliper pistons
specifically sized for the M5, yields shorter stopping distances, better pedal feel, and better results in the ABS J-turn test.

Dave- any chance you could post test results? Even better unbiased 3rd party test results? I've been wondering for a while about actual performance increases on the street. The fade improvement, or lack thereof, on the track seems pretty well corroborated on the board, but that's where it seems to end. Thanks.

DZeckhausen · 15th November 2002, 17:26

Quote:

Originally posted by doug

Dave- any chance you could post test results? Even better unbiased 3rd party test results? I've been wondering for a while about actual performance increases on the street. The fade improvement, or lack thereof, on the track seems pretty well corroborated on the board, but that's where it seems to end. Thanks.

Better yet, I'm planning to fly out to California in December or January and participate in some testing with StopTech. I'll be able to document and photograph their testing procedures and will, of course, post here with all my findings. I've spent hours talking to the StopTech engineers on the phone and some time again last week at SEMA. And they are absolutely confident that their kits will outbrake the competition. I've been pushing them to test a competitor's kit and perhaps they will do so while I'm out there. There are also a bunch of brake kit tests that have recently been published or will be published soon that compare StopTech to others. I believe Roundel Magazine will have a StopTech vs. Rogue vs UUC test in the next issue. Unfortunately, they weren't able to get the radar equipment in time, so the results will be subjective based on the test driver's lap times and feedback.

If you've ever loaded your own ammunition, then the following will make sense to you. You pick a specific type and weight bullet and caliber and then a type of gunpowder. Then you look up in the tables and figure out what is the right amount of powder to load so that your semi-automatic will have enough power to eject the shell casing but not too much so that it will jam. Then you load a few rounds to that specification but you don't stop there. You bracket the specification by loading several rounds with amounts of powder slightly higher and a few at amounts slightly lower than the table value. Then you take it to the shooting range and perform test firings until you find what works perfectly for your gun.

It's the same with brakes. StopTech goes through careful engineering to figure out the stock brake torque based on master cylinder specifications and stock brake geometry. Then they manufacture calipers with specific piston sizes to match the stock balance on the assumption that the car manufacturer optimized their brake's stopping distances. Then they build a few systems with slightly bigger caliper pistons and a few with slightly smaller caliper pistons and head out to the test track. They use stationary mounted radar (the most accurate system for measuring deceleration) and perform J-tests to measure departure angles with ABS engaged. Then they do runs with ABS off and measure stopping distances at threshold braking. They do this for each application and they do it with a bunch of different sizings of caliper pistons in the same day on the same car. You can imagine that they have become quite proficient at installing brake kits and bleeding brake lines! At the end of the day, they often find that it was the kit that used slightly larger or smaller caliper pistons than the theoretical ideal that proved to be the best performer. So they go with that sizing for their kit.

As far as I know, there isn't another aftermarket brake kit builder that does this sort of testing for their brake kits. For example, Brembo uses F40 and F50 calipers and almost always ends up with kits that are more front biased. Marketing pressure contributes to this because the Honda crowd equates nose dive under braking as "better" braking. If it doesn't grab aggressively, the customer doesn't feel like it's an improvement. On the track, any of these kits will have huge gains in longevity and freedom from fade. But it's only the skilled race driver that will be able to tell that the bias isn't quite right. Those of you with race cars and adjustable proportioning valves will know what I'm talking about. You wouldn't put an adjustable prop valve on a beginner or even an intermediate driver's car.

Other brake companies, such as Mov'it, simply make different sized brackets to force fit Porsche calipers on different cars. They have no choice of caliper piston size other than picking and choosing which Porsche model comes closest to having brakes that will work well for the specific application. Sometimes they get real lucky, such as the 4-wheel kit I have on my 2001 540i/6. The balance is very good. On my Impala SS, I had to modify the proportioning valve to make the rear brakes work properly. As I mentioned earlier, Mov'it is switching over to their own manufactured calipers and rotors, so they are a company to watch now, since they might take advantage of this opportunity to make more calipers specifically tailored to the applications. Hopefully, they will also change the form factor of their calipers so they are less likely to require wheel spacers. Right now they are in transition and probably Steve D'Gerolamo at Ultimate Garage is the only one who knows what is really going on there.

So, when I get back from California, I will be sure to post plenty of test photos and results and tell you all about what I learned there. I'm really looking forward to it.