Ran

Looking at possible M3 or M5 purchase. I noticed that a lot of ex M3 owners were on the forum. I was looking for some feedback on the M5 feel when compared to the M3. I do not really have that much NEED for the space but it is a nice to have. How much of the M3 handling, road feel, agility will I lose with the M5. I only got to test drive the M5 in London city when on a trip there. Could not really take it to anywhere close to the limit. Love the torque of course. Oh btw, my dealer here in the US gave me a 540i 6 as the closest approximation to what an M5 may be like since he has no M5 for testing. great torque but too soft for me. But I expect the M5 to be firmer. How much firmer. thanks.

Ran

C43///M5

Are you interested in the E36 or the E46 M3?

I've never driven a 540 before, but I'm sure many people on this forum can tell you the 540 and the M5 are worlds apart in terms of power.

Ran

E46 M3 versus E39 M5. sorry for not clarifying.

[quote]Originally posted by C43///M5:
[b]Are you interested in the E36 or the E46 M3?

AndyMenard

I previously owned a 98 Dinan Supercharged M3, and now own a 2000 BEAST!

If you are looking for the same go-kart handling that the E36 M3 has, you may be dissapointed with the M5. You have to remember that the M5 weighs over 700 pounds more than the E36 M3, and about 550-600 pounds more than the upcoming E46 M3. The M5 comes stock with a fair amount of understeer dialed in on purpose. Of course, if you search our board for previous posts on the subject of "suspension", you will find that many of the folks on this board (myself included) have upgraded the suspension with Dinan/Koni adjustable struts/shocks and anti-sway bars as well as Dinan strut braces. This made a fairly sustantial improvement bringing the car past neutral and more towards oversteer, depending on how firm you have the Koni's set?...

As far as acceleration, the M5 wins big time... although from what I have read, we should expect the new M3 to be a screamer! The M5's brute force torque however is unmistakable!!

You should probably also get input from others hear who also own or owned M3's and can accurately compare the M3 and the M5.

Here is the bottom line as I see it. The M3 is targeting a little different crowd than the M5. The M3 (at least until BMW decides otherwise? ) will only come in a coupe version. The M5 (with its four doors) is very able and happy to lug around you and 3 other adults very comfortably, along with golf clubs in the trunk and the A/C on...and still keep up with Vettes, Porsche C2/C4, Mustangs, and Camaros!! That is really cool ...and don't forget about all that luxury!

Of course, the premium you pay is some loss in agility! You cannot escape the laws of physics no matter what you do?..

My advice... find someone in your area to give you a ride in an M5...so you can make up your own mind! I think you will find the M5 to be INTOXICATING!!!

Good luck with your decision.



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Andy

2000 Imola M5 / Black Nappa - Titanium Trim

Ran

I am more interested in handling and firmness and rigidity etc. 540i was actually pretty powerful considering that it is a non-M car. But handling wise too soft for me.

MEnthusiast

My experience is with the E36 M3 vs. the E39 M5. I traded in my E36 M3 and I think Andy hit the nail on the head with his explanation. I loved the extremely nimble sensation the M3 gave- the M5 doesnt have that. Its extremely nimble for a larger sedan that weighs 4000lbs. IMHO, the M5 gives you the best of both sports car and luxury sedan worlds. The E39 M3 really was a practical sports car, and I would expect the E46 M3 to continue with that- although from what I can see I think the "go cart" sensation the E36 M3 had is getting less priority in favor for more everything in the E46 M3.

So its been nearly 3/4 of a year since I made the switch- did I regret it? The first few days I really wasnt sure- really. I could appreciate the pros of the M5 but I missed the directness of the M3. Around turns I could sense the mass of the M5 much more than I ever did with the M3- and I didnt like that very much.

However, about 3 weeks into it I had adjusted to the M5 and had come to realize what an amazing job BMW has done- it gives great comfort while maintaining the edge and power of a serious sports car. I didnt even sense the mass of the car as I would zing around turns just like I was in the M3. I recently got the chance to drive a E36 M3- I still loved driving it, but I didnt miss having it. Im very happy with my choice. I also realized that the M5 stays almost as flat as the E36 M3 does! It does roll a little more, but certainly not in proportion to the added weight. The only thing I miss just a little bit is the direct link feeling of the M3s steering- the M5s is great- but thats one area that I think the old M3 definately has it over the M5. Hope this was helpful

ME

[This message has been edited by MEnthusiast (edited 19 January 2001).]

PhilSeastrand

My experience is also between an E36 M3 and E39 M5. I don't think you'll find too many people that have driven the new M3.

If I'm coming hard into a 90 degree turn the M5 feels a lot heavier and it feels like I can't take the turn as fast as I could with the M3. However, if I'm moving down a mountain road with a lot of curves it feels like the M5 can go faster and hug the turns better then the M3 did. It feels as if the M5 is much more stable through the turns. I can't explain why if feels this way and maybe if I went back to the M3 (it was sold) and tried it again I might change my mind.

In any case, I have absolutely no second thoughts about making the shift. The raw power and feel of the M5 is unbelieveable. Touch the gas and the car leaps forward, no matter which gear you are in. It's intoxicating.

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Phil

01 M5 Silverstone/Silverstone

Ran

Thanks MEnthusiast and Andy!! Your responses confirmed almost every suspicion for and against that I have as regards the M5. As you can guess, I too am evaluating it as an enthusiast of handling who wants some other things too. If the M3 came as a 4 door sedan it would be even harder to go for the M5 but as it stands it is so evenly balanced for what I need that I resorted to asking for opinions to see if I had missed anything. Even my limited test drive in London seems to have given me an adequately correct impression of what I am in store for as regards the M5. Superbly appointed sport sedan unlike any other and almost equal to the M3 in handling. Steering was a bit more wanting I thought and was the one thing I was hoping to hear from you guys as being good on the M5. I was hoping that my impression was limited by the city driving in London. Well if any of you in the Philadelphia/south jersey area ready to give me a test drive let me know..

thanks all.

and KEEP the opinions coming

AndyMenard

Ran,

If you are a "handling junkie"... buy a used E36 M3 with low miles on it!

This is THE BEST handling car I've ever owned!!!!

Otherwise, if you want alot more luxury as well as that UNBELEIVABLE torque that puts a big smile on your face ... get the M5..

Good luck!!



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Andy

2000 Imola M5 / Black Nappa - Titanium Trim

Ran

I have an E36 M3 as my second car. Just sold my temporary car (E46 328i sport 1999)

waiting on E39 M5 or E46 M3 not yet decided; also want some of the add on toys like NAV etc. though yes, i am more into handling, torque and power. MPOWER!!!!!

Hubcap

I sold my E36 M3 a month ago and bought a new M5. I agree with the other comments already made. One additional point.....the quality of the ride in normal everyday traffic is supremely better in the M5 as compared to the M3. You can be doing 80 mph on the highway and it was like you were doing 55 in the M3. The M5 is soooooo docile when you are doing normal driving and can become so aggreessive at the punch of the accelerator.....it's unbelievable.

The steering IMHO is nearly the same. Actually when you turn the steering wheel hard at slows speeds in the M5, I think it is better that the M3 was.

The rear end of the M5 will break loose much quicker that the M3 ever would....but I think that is the extra horsepower available. I would think the E46 M3 would have the same characteristics as the M5 because of the increased horsepower.

Would I go back to the M3 or consider the new M3 over the M5.....absolutely not!! The M5 is the most absolutely, amazing car I have ever driven. I plan to put a 150,000 miles on it.

Enjoy the ride,

Hubcap 12/'01 - white/caramel

KnightRider

Ran,
i cant imagine how much experience you could have had in london...m5 shows its best on the motorway...you really cant imagine the acceleration it has at those speeds, m3 wont match it in the torque department whatsoever, the max torque is now up the revs and isnt much more than in e36 m3 either.
handling...the feel of an m5 is heavy, but youd be surprised how fast it can take the turns even if it looks or feels improbable...
another thing...you havent mentioned if you will consider engine mods...if yes then m5 is much better suited for that...m3's engine is really pushed now to the limits.

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SL