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South Bend Clutch/SBC Input

25K views 82 replies 34 participants last post by  gsfent 
#1 ·
I've been researching clutches for a long time now. There is little to no information about SBC clutches for the M5.
Search has revealved one long negative thread about a PP issue and praise from a stage 4 Brecus/SBC owner.

Anyone else have input on the stage 2 setup combined with a JBR LTW FW?

Thanks in advance!
 
#2 ·
I had issues with the brecus/sbc setup, it was grinding the 1-2 and 2-3 shift at WOT because the clutch wasn't disengaging all the way, I had to shift very carefully at high rpms and this was without any clutch stop whatsoever... I went with the CNS 10.5/single mass setup and it's doing good for now, still breaking it in.
 
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#3 · (Edited)
FWIW, I had a different experience with the South Bend/Brecus Stage 4. Mine had no engagement issues and I ripped on it at the race track with my S/C Beast repeatedly without a single problem. My only complaints were the additional pedal effort and somewhat abrupt engagement.
 
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#4 ·
Thanks for the reviews gentlemen. I decided to be a test mule on this and have placed an order for the Southbend Stage 2 Endurance Clutch Kit. I will be combining this with a JB Racing lightweight flywheel. I had a long list of PNs to do with this setup, but in order to keep costs down I am not going to be purchasing everything on that list.
Most importantly:
Rear Main Seal
Diff Input Seal
Diff Output Seals
E60 SSK and associated parts
Guibo
Clutch Line
Slave Cylinder
and some small misc parts

I will do a comprehensive review on in the upcoming months of my experience so that others have more info to go off of.

Thanks so much for the responses guys. Honestly Clemster, you experience is why I decided to purchase. Hopefully mine will be the same!
 
#6 ·
ditto.

had them custom build a clutch for a 400whp wideblock-4g64 Mitsu Starion with an Rx7 Turbo transmission.
 
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#8 ·
I decided to try the South Bend Stage III Daily when I rebuilt my car. I'm still in the break-in period, but so far I'm very happy. I like the stiffer pedal (honestly would have prefered even stiffer) and the more abrupt engagement. I get a better response through the pedal on what the clutch is doing.
I did keep the OEM flywheel for now; I ran out of money so I figure I'll upgrade the flywheel in another year or so.
 
#9 ·
I used their Kevlar clutch on my single turbo Mkiv supra. Car put down 510-540 rwhp And the clutch took everything I threw at it for years.
 
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#11 ·
I just want to get an update from South Bend Clutch users. Which one do you have? How is it holding up? Any issues, how does it feel compared to stock? Thanks.
Southbend Stage 2 Endurance. It has been ~10K miles and still holding. Abused every single time I get in the car, usually full throttle romps through the gears, not really many launches, but the grip seems to be even better than before.

Great for daily driving with a very slightly increased pedal effort.

Lets put it this way, I am so impressed that after I go SC I am going to purchase a SouthBend stage 4 when this fails.
 
#13 ·
Although there isn't much info out there, clutch masters and E39 M5s don't seem to work very well together based on the threads/posts I came across while doing my research.

Spec is rebranded by at least one shop and sold at an increased price to E39 M5 owners. Based on the threads/posts I ran across those seem to work well together.

Now this isn't always the case, but the general concensus that I garnered while doing my research. Of course there are those who think spending <1000 for a clutch/flywheel setup as a faux pas, I mean this is an M5, right? Well I know there is no need to spend more than necessary, that much is certain. Then there is the other camp that believes that the OEM stuff works just fine, even on supercharged M5s.

Then there are those of us in the middle, who researched quite a bit and chose a midlevel setup which works lol.
 
#15 ·
Bumping up an older thread, I just had my SouthBend Stage 2 Endurance clutch installed with a lightened OEM Dual Mass Flywheel (CNS). Took a couple days to get used to the different feel from my 10.5" CNS Carbon/Kevlar Kit, but it is nice and smooth and has good positive engagement. I am still in the break in period so I can not chime in on how it feels slamming through the gears, but I have noticed that the pedal feel is much different that what I am used to. I guess the pressure plate on my old CNS kit was super heavy because the SBC system feels very light with much less effort. I had a very linear but heavy feel on the CNS, but now it feels more OEM if I can recall what that feels like (back in 2008). I had to remove my clutch stop because the engagement point is very low to the floor, and with the stop installed, there was zero play, so it was harder to smoothly get off in first gear. With the stop removed, it is much easier to ease into first. Things feel great so far though. I had redline trans fluid placed in the trans, and it is buttery smooth. Something I have not had in many years.

I will report back once I reach my 500 miles and start really feeling this Southbend Clutch out.
 
#16 · (Edited)
I would be interested for updates. I want to plan for new clutch and flywheel set up in few years. I hope my clutch is fine after abusing a little bit on drag track. It was worth the fun pushing M5 to the limit.
 
#17 · (Edited)
What are you currently running? OEM?

It all depends on what you are looking for. The stage 2 Endurance is a little more aggressive vs OEM. It has more positive engagement, which is what I was looking for, but is still totally streetable as smooth starts and shifts are easily obtainable. My previous clutch was more of an on or off type of feel, where throttle blips were necessary. But the SBC is like OEM, but a little more grippy.

I did notice that the clutch disk they use is some sort of hybrid they create? On one side you see LuK, and on the other you read Sachs. I have no idea what they do, or how they do it, but it was an observation of mine.
 
#21 ·
SBC Specs that I have...

STAGE 2 DAILY:
Engineered for HP modifications. This Heavy Duty Pressure Plate has an increased clamp load with little or no increase in pedal pressure. The Organic disc material has a high metal content that increases the co-efficient of friction by two times over a stock lining and increases rotational strength up to a 12,000 RPM burst point. This clutch system maintains a stock feel while offering strength and durability.

Recommended usage is daily, street and moderate race.
 
#22 ·
How much this stage 2 set up usually cost?
 
#23 ·
I purchased the SBC Stage 2 Endurance for $545. This includes the clutch disk, pressure plate, alignment tool and throwout bearing.
I then purchased a lightened OEM dual mass flywheel (32 lbs) from CNS.
 
#25 ·
Still in the break in period, but so far is feels great. Much lighter than my previous 10.5" clutch and much easier to start and shift in general.
I really dont know the difference between stage 2 daily and endurance, but im pretty sure the disk surfaces differ for a slightly more aggressive bite. I do not know if it would feel different with a standard OEM flywheel, but it works like butter with my 32 lbs dual mass.
 
#26 · (Edited)
Just to add to the discussion, here are pics of my CNS 10.5 Clutch and Flywheel. The flywheel had some pretty deep etching on the surface which stumped me as to what could have caused it. You can not really see in the picture what I describe, but trust me they are there.

Also, the disk is pretty well worn out. I could feel it starting about a month ago as pedal feel was different, and the pressure seemed to change. The disk lasted about 50k miles for me, although the claims were that it should last much longer. And I do not track the car or do hard launches. I may drive the car aggressively, and double clutch/ heel toe downshift, which would add to the decreased mileage, but I still thought it would last a little more than 50k miles.



 
#27 ·
So, time for a new clutch. Anymore people around here with south bend experience and how its been since install?
 
#30 ·
Cant complain about it so far. Just make an informed decision on which one to get. I wish I had gone with the Stage 3 Endurance as I prefer a higher clamping clutch feel like I did with the CNS Carbon/Kev cluch I had previously. I have nothing to complain about the SBC clutch, but I just prefer something more "grippy" as I have never liked how stock clutches feel from any manufacturer.

My SBC Stage 2 Endurance has a stock like feel in the pedal and during clutch engagement. If that is what you seek, it is a good choice.
 
#31 ·
I have their Stage 2 Endurance also. Installed new Dinan lightened DM flywheel at the same time.

There is absolutely no increase in pedal effort from stock. I was actually hoping there would be some increase but oh well.

Clutch is fairly new so haven't had it on the track yet but so far so good.
 
#33 · (Edited)
I have a south bend stage 2 daily with a new oem flywheel. Over all very happy with it and have been driving with it for over 5k miles now. Feels like stock but with slightly harder clamp especially noticed if power shifting and not letting the revs drop that extra 200rpm. Or if you slightly miss rev match it is a little less say forgiving than oem. The only issue ive had not sure if its an issue or just something I never noticed before. Maybe due to the alternative compound of the clutch with the flywheel or maybe even the fly wheel is not functioning correctly or something is I ocassionally get a chatter noise if I dont slip it enough from a stop. If I give it more than say 750 rpm no noise. If anyone has insite to this very very slight issue that would be great. Something ive though about maybe causing it is possibly the lever or the clip used to transfer force to the pressure plate causing uneven clamping pressure and a pulsing. That being said I cant feel anything through the clutch pedal so not too sure. Although on occasion usually with quite cold ambiant temperatures a slight bump in the clutch pedal can be felt if just sitting in neutral and pressing it down repeatedly and during that time it is usual for the chatter noise to become apparent when going to set off. Reguardless its a fantastic clutch, when I do the replacement on my fathers M5 we will be using a south bend stage 2 daily with new fly wheel.
 
#35 ·
Just to bring this back up as I am researching clutch options at the moment for a FI setup.


Have there been any issues lately regarding SB clutches, as I have heard that there have been a few recent issues although I do not know what.


Looking to get some more input from folks.


Thanks


Jamie
 
#36 ·
Just to bring this back up as I am researching clutch options at the moment for a FI setup.

Have there been any issues lately regarding SB clutches, as I have heard that there have been a few recent issues although I do not know what.
No issues to report here. I have the stage 3 and the lightened CNS flywheel (~2000 miles on the setup). I also have SB installed on a sled truck - it's one of the only things that hasn't gone tango!
 
#37 ·
Spoke with SBC today. Great customer service and very helpful.

Looks like I am ordering Stage 3 endurance based on the type of driving that I do.
 
#38 ·
Can you go over the deciding factors for the Stage 3 endurance, and not the other clutches that were available?
 
#41 ·
Regarding CNS and UUC, any reason why you wouldn't use UUC, and what was the CNS setup?


I've looked on CNS's site and saw they do 2 kits, 1 that fits a standard FW and one where they enlarge the clutch surface area of the standard DMF so it takes a 10.5" clutch, which look pretty good.


Any reason why those setups aren't much good?
 
#43 ·
I don't believe CNS has the clutch for the regular size FW. 10.5 is nice, but i don't want the extra weight.

Haven't you read enough horror stories about UUC. They are inadequate and I am being very generous with my choice of words. They've screwed up 2 of my previous orders and it took them months to issue the refund.
 
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