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Old 21st October 2009, 22:57   #1
NJ.M5
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1st to 2nd gear shift....

I'm sure some of you will find this offensive, but my beast is my first manual car. I think I have gotten very good at driving stick, watching the old training videos in the FAQ and judging by the engine pitches and smoothness of the ride.

But my 1st to 2nd shift is still a little shakey. I saw another thread about this but shifting in to second isn't always as smooth as the other gears. There are times where I have the clutch pushed in and I will hear a quick grind when shifting from 1st to 2nd. Do I need to change my tranny fluid? I've never done this before and put about 7000 miles on the car since purchase. Is this an easy job?

Anyone else have the same troubles with 2nd gear? Seems to be worsened by the cold, but not sure.
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Old 21st October 2009, 22:59   #2
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Yes, second is often somewhat harder to get the stick into on my car as well. Sometimes it feels like 2nd and 3rd don't have fully functional synchros.
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Old 21st October 2009, 23:05   #3
blackxs
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You may be relieved to hear that the Beast was also the first manual car I have owned The problem is probably your pressure plate. I have a feeling we both probably messed ours up a little bit in the intermediary process of getting accustomed to stickshift, and furthermore - adjusting to the very finicky clutches of our cars.

For further help on your thread please visit this thread:
Please help, trouble shifting off cold start
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Old 21st October 2009, 23:07   #4
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The M5 is also my first manual car. I learned on it and I didn't need to replace the clutch

But yea, I noticed that if you aren't in "sync" with the car, you can engage 2nd gear and get the car to do a hell of a shaky acceleration. There's also a lot of notchiness from 1st to 2nd, but this goes away by shifting at higher RPMs (4k, for example) and once the transmission is warm.
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Old 21st October 2009, 23:16   #5
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Here's the thing with our cars: Because they are high horsepower/torque, the synchros must be able to withstand the torque/hp associated with higher rpms. As a consequence, at lower rpms, the synchro's simply don't work as well.

There are 2 solutions to this problem:
1. Shift very quickly. If you don't let the engine rpms drop too much then you'll get smoother shifting. The longer you wait between shifts the better job you need to do modulating the rpms through gas pedal.
2. Shift at higher rpms. You'll still need to shift quicker, but the synchros will work better because of the higher hp/torque.

With all that said, you may have damaged your synchros but I'd be surprised if you did any damage to your clutch or pressure plate...

d-
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Old 21st October 2009, 23:18   #6
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Diny, isnt yours also significantly lower mileage? I am at around 90K now on the original clutch! Its overdue anyways...
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Old 21st October 2009, 23:20   #7
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you should let first run a little longer, don't just put your foot in it to go into the next gear

like the others said - your synchros are getting worn and youll need more inertia to ease their load
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Old 21st October 2009, 23:23   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackxs View Post
Diny, isnt yours also significantly lower mileage? I am at around 90K now on the original clutch! Its overdue anyways...
I got mine at 60k and am now at 97k, 2 years later.

This isn't the original clutch, though. People before me beat the hell out of the clutch and (if my mind serves right), this is the 5th clutch that my car's seen. I'm the 3rd owner, too. I know that the clutch was changed a lot at first because I checked the service records.

Last edited by Diny; 21st October 2009 at 23:24.
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Old 21st October 2009, 23:24   #9
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Right! As usual the answer is: flog it!

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Old 21st October 2009, 23:30   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DouglasABaker View Post
Here's the thing with our cars: Because they are high horsepower/torque, the synchros must be able to withstand the torque/hp associated with higher rpms. As a consequence, at lower rpms, the synchro's simply don't work as well.

There are 2 solutions to this problem:
1. Shift very quickly. If you don't let the engine rpms drop too much then you'll get smoother shifting. The longer you wait between shifts the better job you need to do modulating the rpms through gas pedal.
2. Shift at higher rpms. You'll still need to shift quicker, but the synchros will work better because of the higher hp/torque.

With all that said, you may have damaged your synchros but I'd be surprised if you did any damage to your clutch or pressure plate...

d-
I gotta ask, on point 1... at low speeds I find going into second its better to shift a little slower because when I shift really fast, the engine revs are higher than the wheel speed so it grips, bites, and shakes the car (very unsmooth shift) and thats when I hear the grinding. If I clutch in, shift, pause, clutch out - the revs fall and the engine speed matches the wheel speed, minimizing syncro wear (which is what I thought was going on) and the grinding is much more quiet. Are you telling me that by doing what makes it quieter and smoother is actually damaging my car? If so - boy howdy I am gonna start shifing much faster!

Also, my local indy said I was damaging my pressure plate. How would I have damaged the syncros? These transmissions are pretty beefy from what I understand, and the whole point of syncros is to alleviate wear is it not? Forgive me if this is a stupid question, I am just thirsty for knowledge I really dont want to mess up my syncros and have to get a new transmission for 4K since there is no rebuild for these...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diny View Post
I got mine at 60k and am now at 97k, 2 years later.

This isn't the original clutch, though. People before me beat the hell out of the clutch and (if my mind serves right), this is the 5th clutch that my car's seen. I'm the 3rd owner, too. I know that the clutch was changed a lot at first because I checked the service records.
5th clutch! My goodness, thats one every 20K miles or so! Hopefully yours will last longer, it certainly sounds like you know how to properly take care of it even if the previous owners did not...

Last edited by blackxs; 21st October 2009 at 23:31.
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