Some of you might know me as a journalist from Autocar Magazine in the UK and other titles too. A few months ago I left to start a motoring website called Drivers-Republic.com with two guys from Evo magazine (Richard Meaden and Jethro Bovingdon). We've been up-and-running for a few months now, and it's going well.
Reason for the post is that alongside some of the newer cars we're running on out long term fleet (one of which is a gorgeous new M3 saloon) I've just bought a 2001 E39 M5. largely because I've always wanted one and they're now such good value I couldn't resist it. The idea is to live with it and slowly improve it.
Last month I fitted an AP front brake kit which has made a huge difference, but looking forward I'd like to take some of the laziness from the handling (without compromising the ride) get my iPod to work and find a neat handsfree phone solution.
It would be immensely helpful if I could sporadically ask you guys for some advice because you know far more about this car than I do!
By all means have a look and get involved over there or just post here.
The first port-of-call has to be the chassis though. I hear that Bilstein do a decent adjustable kit for the E39, but is there anything else out there worth considering? The car's running an old set of Michelin Pilot Sport2s at the moment, and it has the vaguest turn-in imaginable -especially in the wet. Also, what's the best rubber out there? Back in the day when these car were new and we had them in the Autocar office we used to prefer them on Michelins to the equivalent Dunlops, but I'm not so sure now!
Anyways, thanks in advance for any help you guys give me.
Welcome to the board Chris! I think we are a few here who like your style, and think of you as being just as entertaining to watch as Clarkson, Needell etc. I found your Veyron review really good for getting a feel for the acceleration of that car.
You will find a lot of experience here with former and current owners. I will offer some iPod expertise if you like (I architected a few products while I was at Apple and know a thing or two about the car integration). The E39 M5 is indeed great value now.
welcome chris , love your reviews on cars, specially the new m3 on the ring review..awsome.
for the handling i would say bilstein pss9 is the best then kw suspensions,h&r coilovers,fk motorsport coilovers,etc..
bilstein has the best set up (spring strenght) for the m5, especially for the ring.when the car reboundes back, the car body dont go down again. its shock in/out/ and flat again..
kw suspensions V2 or V3 variant are also very good, but there springload is a bit softer, especially for the ring. most off the time it bounces/dips twice when you hit a deeper spot on the ring.. with the kw you feel when the car rebounds , it has more effort to get it straith back to a flat position.
h&r has the same karacter as the kw,only its a little more to the tuning side then the racing side when you talk about performance.
fk motorsports..same as h&r.more tuning then racing.
but dont get me wrong, they are all good, only bilstein and kw are a bit more racing minded developped then the rest.
everything gots his price offcourse.
another thing that improves handeling is buy/put some rear wheels for on the front ,with 3mm spacers..
it improves understeer allot...so 4x 9.5 wheels with 255/40/18 and 275/35/18 and your rolling like on a traintracks..
for the i pod, enough info can be found on this board.try to search for dicelink or search for DougAbaker posts, he's our electrical/audio guru:biggrin:.. sorry i got stuck when evolution went on:grinyes:
im still in the cd period..
another thing that improves handeling is buy/put some rear wheels for on the front ,with 3mm spacers..
it improves understeer allot...so 4x 9.5 wheels with 255/40/18 and 275/35/18 and your rolling like on a traintracks..
There is so much expertise available here on the board. Just search a little bit and if you don't find what you need, pop off a question and you'll receive very good input to solve your problems. Get to know your ///M and find where you want to make improvements, there is no end to what you can do to her, as I'm sure you know. Also, no end to the money you can spend to mod her to your specs!
Have a great time on the board as well as driving your beast!
Welcome to the board! :byebye:I've always been an avid Evo reader and I'm with Danish on your style too.
I have to congratulate you on your choice of long termer..... What mileage has it done, as "vague" is not a word I have ever heard associated with the E39 M5? I'm thiniking that for starters you just need to spend a couple of hundred quid having ball joints and bushes replaced. I bought my 2000 car with KW3 already installed and whilst it was astonishingly good hammering across the Malverns or the B660, anywhere else it was just horrible. It made motorways less relaxing, you had to slow down to walking pace to negotiate a bumpy country lane and as for city driving - forget it! I swapped the KW3's for a 15,000 mile old set of stock suspension with a member of this board and have never looked back. I guess it depends what you want to use the car for, and no doubt I'll be shot down by others here, but unless it's purely a plaything, I would stick to stock. Just my tuppence worth......
As for audio, check out www.toysinyourcar.com. I used their leads to install my Archos PMP with great success. Now I have every CD I ever bought with me at all times, along with video and even a back-up Sat Nav!
Chris Harris with an e39 M5! Awesome! I just wanted to say that you have some excellent reviews for autocar. I like your style. Last reviewer that I enjoyed as much as you was/is Tiff Needell. 1000% better than American reviewers (imho). I know it might sound absurd, but the Brit accent somehow adds a certain level of automotive credibility... Anyway, welcome to M5board. Do your new company need any new employees? I work for cheep!
Welcome to the board! As I was watching your review of your own E92 M3 the other day (yes a bit late), I wondered how you would compare it to the E39 M5 since the specs are similar.
You can pretty much find any information you need on this board from what modifications/upgrades to do to maintenace items etc. There are a lot of "car nuts" here. ;-)
Thanks so much for the advice, I'd certainly rather get the standard chassis in good condition before considering some aftermarket gear. Has anyone fitted different bushes or are the standard BMW items best?
nerio2: I think your machine's a bit too extreme for me!! However, it sounds awesome.
100%- those black boxes look ideal for extracting some flexibility and decent sound from the standard hi-fi -will report back on how I get on.
As for rubber, I'm tempted to try some standard Pirellis because they always work for me, and mottati your comment on the PS2 is quite correct.
Anyways, I'll keep updating the DR long term page. The next thing to look out for is a fitting tyre-replacement ritual. There's no point in throwing away rubber unless there's bits of fabric and metal sticking out of it, so I'll go to a track and film the destruction process under the subterfuge of a 'how to drift your E39 M5 video'
Thanks so much for the advice, I'd certainly rather get the standard chassis in good condition before considering some aftermarket gear. Has anyone fitted different bushes or are the standard BMW items best?
nerio2: I think your machine's a bit too extreme for me!! However, it sounds awesome.
100%- those black boxes look ideal for extracting some flexibility and decent sound from the standard hi-fi -will report back on how I get on.
As for rubber, I'm tempted to try some standard Pirellis because they always work for me, and mottati your comment on the PS2 is quite correct.
Anyways, I'll keep updating the DR long term page. The next thing to look out for is a fitting tyre-replacement ritual. There's no point in throwing away rubber unless there's bits of fabric and metal sticking out of it, so I'll go to a track and film the destruction process under the subterfuge of a 'how to drift your E39 M5 video'
The standard bushes are good enough but tyre wise any of the decent makes will suffice but I didnt rate Dunlops at all and Toyos are much quieter and grippier but wear out quick;3 sets of rears in 15k- the fronts will wear badly on the outer edge which can be a pain.
While I agree disasters can happen, it seems to me that the E39 M5 has to be one of the most reliable daily-driver 400 hp cars ever. I had an E39 528 and then 530 before the M5 and as such my standards were (are) high. After 4 years and 40k miles with my car (now at 57k miles) I am not disappointed. One hesitates to tell how good things are going, lest a disaster ensue, but surely no 400-hp engine is free from all *possible* problems (well of course no engine is). Every time I consider selling the car (and after 4 years, it has come up) I counter with: "and replace it with what, and at what cost?" Truly a car for the ages. I'm not saying I will not sell it, but if I do it will still be the best car I've ever owned (including my M coupe, which I also love).
You are very hard on the the OEM brakes; obviously we have different needs and expectations. I will say that I am still on my original rotors and pads and have been pleased with the street performance and longevity of the brakes.
Your new Driving Republic online magazine is good enough to make me consider not renewing my Evo subscription! About the M5:
Tyres: Consensus tend to be Michelin Pilot Sport 2 or the new Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric (can of worm warning) - I will be trying the latter next time
Ipod: I really like the Intravee, and if you have the sat nav it integrates perfectly.
Handling: neerio covered it very well. New tires may also help, but I will be doing the bushes on mine soon to take out the slack induced by 100.000 miles
Welcome to the board Chris; it will be a pleasure to read about your experiences with the M5.
If you've got a good one, these cars really take some beating - even more so when you consider the current prices on the second hand market . Mine is now at a faultless 153,000 miles (bought about three and a half years ago with 50k miles) and it still puts a smile on my face every morning.
I agree with getting the standard chassis up to top condition first; for normal road use the standard suspension set up is a wonderful balance of comfort and poise when in good condition. For such a big car it can be made to really dance down a country road. Ditto the brakes - for road work they are more than up to the job . As a track warrior though, it does need beefier brakes and a firmer suspension set up.
As you may have gathered, we are quite a friendly bunch so if you do have any questions please do post them and I'm sure you'll get a hoard of responses.:cheers:
Just went to get something from the car, and found both rear footwells are damp. Something common, or do I need to get my local spanner to hunt the missing grommet?
I'm not remotely precious about my cars, but do draw the line at semi-aquatic rear cabins!!
Welcome Chris, PSS9s on my M5, great all round, used at the ring a number of times. Comfortable but flat. Enjoy the car. Is the exhaust standard still? Unless the family (wife) has an issue with it look for something that will release the V8 H&S on mine currently
(We were in the same year at Clifton by the way... )
Chris, which bushes are you referring to? thrust arm bushings are common failures on these cars. Last time around, i used X5 (v8) bushings, which are a little bit stiffer and seem to be working well. Next time around, i'll probably get the dinan monoballs and new control arms (with new ball joints).
I was thinking of all the suspension rubbers to be honest. The car's quite heavy and there's a lot of supple mounting to give low nvh levels, and these things will always perish in the British climate. Problem is, I haven't the time (or the skill) to do it myself and therefore it'll cost a fair whack, and still you're left with the uncertainty that you might want to fit aftermarket bits anyway. How does one 'test drive' Bilstein PSS9s for a short period of time? Think I'll be phoning their press office in the morning....
Hi Chris, welcome to M5board! It's very nice to see you here. I also enjoy reading about your driving experience behind many cars.
Not that I mind a bit, but the avatar you chose on the main page of the M5 report is actually a picture I have taken of my beloved '00 carbon black M5 in Hong Kong a few years ago. It was a pleasant surprise seeing that picture as I have sold the car sometime back and miss it greatly. E39 M5's are a rarity here and a carbon black one even more so where I am. Glad to learn that you have gotten yourself one. Mine was eventually fitted with Tubi exhausts so it can sing a more vocal and pleasant note. Now I am itching to get one back since the prices are getting very attractive.
->
Btw, have you done anything more on that green monster 911 of yours?
E39 M5's are a rarity here and a carbon black one even more so. Glad to learn that you have gotten yourself one. Mine was eventually fitted with Tubi exhausts so it can sing a more vocal and pleasant note. Now I am itching to get one back since the prices are getting very attractive.
You should check out that E39 M5 on 28car....the price is reasonable and if i haven't bought a A4 avant for DD use.....i'll buy it....2 E39 M5 sounds crazy in HK :biggrin:
I have a 2001 M5 like you. My car rides on 19" BBS CH rims -- but otherwise is stock.
One of the things I found needed improvement was the suspension. The stock 7 year old dampers and springs were rubbish -- the car felt ponderous and floaty.
I recently upgraded to the Bilstein PSS9 suspension and replaced all the bushings while they were at it.
It is a NIGHT and DAY difference in terms of how great the car feels now. On my favourite exit ramp here in Vancouver, on the way to one of my offices, I can take that cambered corner at least 25 km/h faster than I ever dared before -- the car feels that great. Perfectly damped and nice, crisp response -- especially handling the heavier 19" rims.
Apologies KRM, I didn't even know that picture was on the site. SteveD, who I think is a member of this forum among a zillion others is involved with DR too, and he's much better with these internet things than me. He probably noticed I'd done something wrong and added that shot. Fairly obvious that it isn't my car because mine will never be that clean.
DoctorJ, you seem to eloquently summarise the effect these cars have on people. Its a four door saloon car and you are remembering minimum apex speeds on the way home. Excellent work fella.
When I've got a few minutes spare, I'll get hold of the Bilstein man.
The name Dinan seems to appear here with the same frequency as 'E39'. Being new to this BMW-fettling-world, are they the reference point in aftermarket bits?
Hello Chris and welcome on the board. Your reviews are very nicely written and just love the new site, I think my boss would be pretty angry at the time I have spent reading that in the last few weeks. Great photos also in the reviews.
Anyways, great that you have acquired a M5 long-termer, will be interesting to see how that develops. This is a great place for getting info and help should there be trouble as you already know.
Onto Dinan. It is one of the best tuners for BMW, more alike to Alpina perhaps but still a tuner. Something like Ac Schnitzer/Hartge in that it has very good relations with BMW (NA not Gmbh though). Not very well known in Europe as they do not have a presence here. Oh and they are quite expensive as well. They have tuning packages that go to around 470hp naturally aspirated (dinan s2) and the supercharged full kit that some members have is c 600hp (dinan s3)..
Welcome Chris. Dinan is a US based tuner who offers vast assortment of products that are well tested and reliable (also very pricey). I woudl also suggest you check out Kelleners Sport out of Germany. Ralf races in Le Mans quite a bit and their products are absolutely no nonsense and good quality. It might make your research a lot easier to jsut stick with the one company for everything. If that is the case, those are the two I would reccomend. Looking forward to seeing your reviews and best of luck with the new magazine.
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