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MAF information

12K views 56 replies 18 participants last post by  London Mike  
#1 ·
I’ve pulled together some information that might be of interest. I didn’t know whether to put it into the main MAF thread but it’s slightly different so I thought I’d start a new thread

My MAFs needed changing. Like everyone else I didn’t want to pay main dealer prices so I was intending to go the VW route which most people seem to have had success with. But I was keen to try and find a bit more about them before putting them on my engine. I know that most cars seem to run fine but I wanted to know exactly what the difference was, I’m a bit retentive like that… :D

So after lots of phoning around I discovered that a friend of mine has a good contact in the Bosch tech department in Germany. A couple of weeks ago I managed to get hold of him and I had a long chat. I explained the problem and said that a lot of people were running the F 00C 2G2 032’s instead of the F 00C 2G2 029’s the car was built with, he said he’d look into it for me and call me back with some info. He got back to me a couple of days later and confirmed what most people have discovered already, the 032’s will work fine, the curve is the same but they will run about 4% richer than the 029’s

One thing led to another and I asked him what the possibility would be of sourcing some genuine 029’s. For obvious reasons I’m not going into too much detail, but yesterday a package arrived with 2 brand new shiny 029’s in it. I fitted them and the car is back to it’s old self, they bolted straight into the existing tubes and obviously had the tags for the plugs to engage with, they are genuine Bosch MAf’s as fitted to the car by BMW. I’ve attached a couple of pics showing how they arrived

The cost to me was about £115 each including shipping, slightly more than if I’d got the VW units, but way less than the £240 main dealer price. I may be able to get more if there was any interest. I’m not sure what the dealer’s price is in the USA? Realoem says $367? On this exchange rate they would work out to probably $250 + shipping. It may be of more interest to UK guys, I don’t know….

I hope no one minds me posting this, I’m not touting for business, just sharing some info and offering a possible source for genuine parts if there was any interest. I know the amount of work that went into sourcing and confirming that the VW units worked, and I’m not trying to undermine what’s been done. But if you believe the guy in Germany they appear to fuel slightly rich, personally I’m a lot happier fitting the correct part :)
 

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#5 ·
the curve is the same but they will run about 4% richer than the 029’s
Here's what I think:

The MAF curve may theoretically 4% 'richer', or maybe I should say on a component basis, it may be 4% richer, but the motor runs on a closed loop feedback with the O2 sensors driving the fuel trim to the same stoichiometric endpoint. You will not run richer- the car, if it has fresh plugs & o2s will run just the same.

If you are running 4% rich the DME will slowly adjust the long term fuel trim to zero that out! While the MAF might be sending a 'richer; signal to the DME, the DEM will say "I am going to correct your signal since when I use your signal the O2s tell me it is too rich, so I am going to back down your inputs to keep the O2s happy".


Here's another thought: Eventually as the MAF becomes fouled by pollution, the perceived airflow will drop and they will be right AT 0%! (Yes, the fuel trim will adjust back) So using a maf that is a tad rich may, in fact, give it a longer service life.
 
#6 ·
I know of someone who did back-to-back dyno runs with 029's and 032's and saw about 2% richer with the 032's so I am inclined to believe the guy from Germany. Yes the DME may adjust over time so the 032's run correctly but personally I'd rather fit the correct part for the sake of a few extra $$$$$ rather than rely on the DME's adaptions

But hey, what do I know, I'm only reporting what I have been told :)
 
#12 ·
The 'correct part' is a distinction without meaning!

We all believe what we want to believe and if you somehow have a strong emotional attachment to 'stock' and 'factory' and 'original' then you will have a bias to assume that anything outside of those descriptors is inferior. Data presented that supports this feeling will be believed, data to the contrary, rejected.

Once you understand how the DME works you will realized that all DMEs adapt constantly.... if you did not, in fact, 'rely on the DME's adaptations' your car would only work right for a moment when all new parts were installed and the planets aligned.

I know that warm and fuzzy feeling when "real BMW parts" are installed. But you are kidding yourself.

Any data from this "guy from Germany"???? (If it was posted here I was clearly asleep!) Did he run 50 miles after resetting the DME to allow re-setting of the adaptions? New plugs and O2 sensors?

If there is a real difference, I certainly want to know about it and communicate it to our members!

A
 
#14 ·
Holy crap! $331.00 for each BMW MAF?

I think I paid $67.00 each for my VW MAF. And as Ard have said, if there is a difference, the DME learns to adjust.

Again, I have zero issue on my VW MAF. And many others here too.

part number for maf i have is

13621433566
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD id=r01>HOT-FILM AIR MASS METER</TD><TD class=p1 id=r00></TD><TD id=r01>2</TD><TD id=r00></TD><TD id=r01></TD><TD id=r00 noWrap>13621433566</TD><TD id=r01 noWrap align=right>$367.16</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

dealer quoted $331.00


 
#19 · (Edited)
excellent... so many results in the archs its hard to sift through it all... i appreciate the help.

secondly, a buddy of mine is telling me that these are a bit taller than the stock bmw maf sensors. but not sure if it effects performance or there are any leaks... since there arent any returns on MAF sensors could ppl verify?

lastly; which tool (size) is needed to remove the sensor from the housing?
 
#30 ·
PM? Oh common. Where are you getting these VW MAFS for $70.00? Some of us would like to know. Hey, you can PM me too.

:cheers:

Vic
 
#32 ·
Mike,

Really appreciate your efforts on this one. For the sake of a few ££ I'd rather go stock on this (3rd party mechanical upgrades are one thing but BMW electrics are a law unto their own IMHO).

Can you put me down for 2? I'll drop you a PM.

Thanks
Alan
 
#39 · (Edited)
the part number on the sensor remains the same...

the part number on the box / housing # 0 280 218 002

scan for codes before hand... nothing.
scan for codes after insall... nothing...
no idle hunt, or difficulty starting...

one thing i did notice, is that driving locally there was no noticeable change in anything... however once i took the car on the highway, i noticed a difference at WOT; primarily first/second gear...
 
#40 ·
PM sent
 
#45 ·
MAF price update

My 2001 with 76,500 miles threw a P0171 yesterday (lean left bank), and I'm going to assume it's the sign of my MAF's starting to die. I took them out and cleaned them, but I know I will soon need to replace them. This thread is pretty old, so I thought I would update it since prices have changed. BTW I am not interested in using the VW specific MAF parts.


I have found the following vendors and prices for the BOSCH Part NumberF 00C 2G2 029:

Both BeastPower and BimmerZone offer a kit that includes two (2) MAF's and a little wrench for $345.00 (or $172.50 each):

Bosch MAFS (Mass Air Flow Sensor) Kit for the BMW 540i and M5 (e39) | BeastPower Motorsports

BMW E39 M5 MAF sensors BOSCH Mass Air Flow Sensor MAFS, also for 540 5 series


World Car Parts (UK, but ships to US) has them for $78.42 each. This deal sounds almost too good to be true and makes me wonder if they are not some Chinese made Bosh imitation:

BMW Air Flow Meter ( Sensor) F00C2G2029

Has anyone ever purchased a MAF from World Car Parts before and would care to provide a review?
 
#46 ·
World Car Parts (UK, but ships to US) has them for $78.42 each. This deal sounds almost too good to be true and makes me wonder if they are not some Chinese made Bosh imitation:

BMW Air Flow Meter ( Sensor) F00C2G2029

Has anyone ever purchased a MAF from World Car Parts before and would care to provide a review?
I spoke to them originally when I was trying to source these and just called him again now to check, they are Chinese aftermarket parts
 
#47 · (Edited)
Thanks Mike. I also just found out from some other Forum members that the units old by "World Car Parts" are indeed "Made in China" and not real Bosch products. The old saying "If it sounds to good to be true it probably is" truly applies.

When I'm ready I'll purchase the real Bosh parts, probably from Bimmerzone unless I can find them for less.<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
 
#48 ·
No problem :)

I can still source these from Germany, just supplied a set today actually, the price went up to £260 a pair because of the Euro/£ exchange rate. But the £/$ has swung in your favour now so I don't know if £260 a pair is a better deal for everyone on the other side of the pond than it was originally
 
#50 ·
I wonder if the "VW Mafs" have changed over the years as Bosch modified manufacturing locations...or indeed as cheap Chinese forgeries have flooded the market...

Thoughts?
I don't know what you mean by 'changed', I am sure that they still fuel the same as they ever did but they will still be too rich for the M5, read my first post in the thread to see what the Bosch techie told me about them...

So after lots of phoning around I discovered that a friend of mine has a good contact in the Bosch tech department in Germany. A couple of weeks ago I managed to get hold of him and I had a long chat. I explained the problem and said that a lot of people were running the F 00C 2G2 032’s instead of the F 00C 2G2 029’s the car was built with, he said he’d look into it for me and call me back with some info. He got back to me a couple of days later and confirmed what most people have discovered already, the 032’s will work fine, the curve is the same but they will run about 4% richer than the 029’s
At the time I had a long conversation with a well known UK dyno operator who had seen several M5's running the VW MAfs and he told me that's pretty much what he has found too