kees

Hi guys,

One of our board members, Momo 5 (Max), has had his '93 M5 3.8 stolen and damaged. To keep the cost down of repairing, ideally these parts need to be sourced secondhand. If anyone has a lead to any of these parts, please post here or contact me per PM. The key components he's looking for are the following:
1) complete front suspension (incl wishbones)
2) complete rear suspension
3) set of 'throwing star' alloys

Any suggestions gratefully received.

Thanks, Kees

IvanDias

Kees,

Sorry to hear about that. Everyones Nightmare.


Are you aware of what a big job this is. Actually I`ll rephrase that. Do you have the ability to have the car off the ground with a pit under it, or is this being done "on the driveway"?

Do you have a complete toolkit (proper) to do this.


The reason I ask is that I have just replaced the Rear Axle Carrier and both trailing arms, shocks etc on a 535i, and it is not a fun job IMO.

You`ll really need two of you to get the damn diff out and back in, and I recommend the Bentley 5 Series manual for all the torque settings an pics to put it back together again. There are quite a few bolts and bits, as the entire braking system has to come off, so stating the obvious, label the bolts and put in little plastic bags.



This followig may be considered a "thinks aloud".

My 535i was considered a writeoff because to have a BMW dealer do the job was £3500 inc parts.
I did it (am doing it) after buying the complete rear of another 535i for £210 delivered.

I would not throw the car away.


Now your M5 needs more than this. If by "complete rear suspension", you mean trailing arms, brake system, hoses n pipes, driveshafts etc, plus the whole lot again, isn`t it cheaper to sell it and start again. Plus you have the aggro of the self levelling system I avoided.

Surely the insurers have paid the value of the car, and you and I know that there are several bits on a M5 which are highly in demand.

When I bought my 1990 M5 3.6 in July, I was vying with scrap dealers to buy it. The car was worth its value £5000-6000 in parts according to them.



Would it not be worth using the insurance money you have recieved, then selling the perfectly good and desirable M5 engine, and the gearbox (like gold dust, them).
Add in complete leather interior and you still have the Windows, windscreen, electric motors, ECU, Exhaust, OBC and wiring loom.


I know you then have the aggravation of tracking down another M5, but this may be the way to go.


Ivan.



PS. If you don`t want to do this, and it would break my heart to do it myself if I was in this position, then I got my bits from going to www.autotrader.co.uk and clicking on the salvage section.

This allows you to email "400" scrap dealers up and down the country with one e-mail. You then await them to all call you. It works.

If you are friendly with your local BMW dealer, then it may be worth looking up on the BMW computer some part numbers.

Things like the tie rods, steering linkages, axle carrier and quite probably trailing arms are the same as the 535i that was taken to Motorsport GMBH to become your M5.

The brakes are not obviously, but a scrap dealer generally cuts brake hoses and abs sensor cables when they take trailing arms off. The hoses etc will have to be rebought from BMW Dealer.


Is your suspension missing or bent/broken?

If its bent, then at leat the brake hoses, bowden cables etc will be intact. If its missing, then this is going to be a long haul.


If there is anything I can check with you at my local dealer then mail me, otherwise, having just replaced the axle carrier on my 535i (M5 is based on it as you know), then if there is any advice you need on taking it to bits, then mail me.

I cannot help on the self-levelling system, as even the bentley manual does and overview of it, but says take to main dealer as they have the tools.


PPS. If you need trailing arms, get them WITH the wheel bearings. My dealer wants an outrageous £80 to fit, plus the wheel bearing (!) and thats if I take the trialing arm off the car to them
Its special tools to seat them properly, but I bet 95% of the time is taking the arm off the car, and thats already done.

__________________
"Never enter Karussell when on the brakes! I have gone round there on the roof, I know what I'm talking about." ~ Sabine Schmitz

kees

Ivan,

Just to clarify: I am helping out Momo5 (Max). Basically the suspension on his car was damaged by joyriders and he wants to rebuild the car. I think he understands the size of the job involved, but has no choice. Max will be using a BMW specialist instead of attempting it himself.

I went to see the car yesterday at the breakers yard. The car cant really be inspected on a ramp. From what we could see the rear axle is bent and the front right suspension is lower and slightly back when compared to the front left suspension. So basically we are asssuming the complete suspension needs to be replaced and putting together an appropriate costing. Brakes, ABS sensors, etc can probably be taken from the existing damaged suspension, we will probably only require wishbones/trailingarms/etc, things that are damaged and/or bent.

Maybe you could give me a bit more information on how the damage was inflicted on your 535i and what needed to be replaced.

Buying a new M5 is not really an option because Max (&myself) are living in Ireland, there are not really any M5s in Ireland and importing a car from abroad will cost 45% importation tax.

We may be calling on your expertise with regards to rear axle replacement.

Using autotrader.co.uk is a good idea. Thanks!

Best regards, Kees

IvanDias

Understand the cars not yours, will refer to it as "yours" to include your mate.

Before I write a big post with some ideas and help...




When you say the rear axle is "bent", what exactly is wrong?

Are the wheels out? Can you tell how it happened? eg. if they hit a kerb handbraking it, was there damage on the wheel? Are the wheels missing, if so I take it all the brake disks are damaged.


I have bad news.

I reversed my 535i into a post I didn`t see, and the back tyre took the impact at 3-5mph. The back wheel was shoved an inch forward.

This requires;
New axle carrier.
New trailing arms.
Fuel lines crushed when axle carrier moved forward.
Doesn`t read like much does it?

This came to £3500 for BMW to fix. No independant would touch it, as once you lift and start the job, it `aint coming down till its done. Expect just the rear to take a competent mechanic 10-15hrs if all goes sweetly.

Now the reason I say this, is that even BMW said there is a small chance (10-20%) that the chassis is bent. This can be fixed using a special Jig that BMW transport down from London.


But; and it`s a biggy....

1. You can`t tell whether the chassis is bent until all the rear components have been replaced and everything put back together. Whatever your mechanic charges, plus parts plus a £100 BMW KDS check or suitable good alignment.

2. If the chassis is bent, everthing has to come off again, and the car has to be jigged. £1400+VAT quoted by BMW bournemouth, not including the time to take it to bits and back, nor the £100 KDS check at the end.


So, you could pay your guy all the time to assemble the new bits, then have to pay him again to take it to bits again, then all the cost of the jigging procedure by BMW, then put it back togther again!

Then you have the additional cost of a professional inspection by a registered company with HPI, if you want it off their "check condition" report when you HPI it.

Even then, the car is going to HPI as "condition repair OK" and not just `nothing to see here` if you ever want to sell it.



It`s taken months of on-off work to do the repair on mine, and within a few days, I`ll know whether it passes an MOT. It could all have been a waste of time. (40-60hrs plus).




I crashed my car at 5mph and may have bent the chassis.
How hard was yours hit?


Think long and very hard before you start.




Ivan.

PS. For a scary picture, check out the black car at www.abcwarrior.com
It is my website.

IvanDias

Just had a thought.

You have no wheels.


1. Ask your local dealer for any old steel rims, even without legal tyres. At least the car can be pushed about or loaded onto a trailer.

2. If you are looking for some throwing stars, remember that they are the older turbines with the turbines taken off and 4 x £75 stars added, plus a new set of wheelbolts. (different size.)

3. If you decide to buy something different, say some spanking new design, then if you do have one or more 9" rears undamaged, I would be interested in buying them off you.

kees

Thanks for the advice. Actually, the wheels are still on the car...they have just been damaged beyond repair. Basically, the joyriders did burnouts until one of the rear tires burst. Also, they seem to have hit a kerb hard enough to bend the suspension.

The car has no visibile damage other than that the wheels are sitting under the car at an angle. The rear axle is bent enough to be easily visible out of alignment. I'm thinking we can get 2 new rear rims & one front rim and use the 'throwing star' covers from the old wheels.

Thanks about the rear axle advice. It may be relevant. I was hoping to maybe jig the car before starting on the repairs.

HPI status is irrelevant in Ireland, as there is no such system here. Additionally, I have advised Max to only start on the repairs if he intends to keep the car for longer time, otherwise it really isnt worthwhile going through all the hassle.

momo5

keesdh, Ivan, thanks for all your discussions. I did not know this posting until now.

Ivan gave me a clear idea how big job would it be. At this moment, I have to be very careful about the cost because the insurance company pay only Irish £ 4500 that is British £ 3700 and $ 5500.

Yesterday, my car was towed away from the yard where she had sat for a month to the special shop. I did it primarily to determine how badly my car was damaged and to know the cost estimation.

I am not very reluctant to fix it according to the information by Ivan. I’ve already spent some money that did not create any positive result except having met good friends.

I will post when I know something.

Momo5

kees

Max,

I am currently abroad, but will be back in Ireland on Sunday night, so keep me posted how things progress. It is a good idea to have spoken with Ivan to determine how much work it will be.

/Kees